PT391 – Dr. Devon Christie & Dr. Pamela Kryskow, MD – MDMA-Assisted Psychotherapy For Fibromyalgia and Other Central Sensitization Syndromes

In this episode, Joe interviews Dr. Devon Christie: Senior Lead of Psychedelic Programs at Numinus, educator at CIIS and Vital, and MAPS-certified MDMA therapist; and Dr. Pamela Kryskow, MD: founding board member of the Psychedelic Association of Canada and Medical Lead of the nonprofit, Roots To Thrive.

Christie and Kryskow recently co-authored one of the first papers looking at MDMA for chronic pain, "MDMA-assisted therapy is associated with a reduction in chronic pain among people with post-traumatic stress disorder," which came about after they received access to MAPS' Phase 2 data from a lead-in PTSD study and noticed significant improvements in pain measurements – something the study was not looking for at all. They're looking into where chronic pain fits within the frameworks of Western medicine and psychedelic-assisted therapy, and discuss the many reasons why MDMA should be tremendously helpful for chronic pain and other conditions that fall under the large umbrella of central sensitivity syndromes and nociplastic pain. They are currently working on a new study following the MAPS protocol that will research MDMA-assisted psychotherapy specifically for people with fibromyalgia, which some believe might be physicalized PTSD. If you'd like to contribute a tax-deductible donation, visit giving.viu.ca, select "other" from the dropdown, and type in "MDMA for Fibromyalgia."

They talk about how research trials focus too much on the molecule while ignoring what the patient is saying; how a large percentage of physicians and patients don't at all like the psychometrics used in measuring data; how physicians regularly use expectancy bias but research trials don't (and how that affects results); why everyone needs to place higher importance on the biopsychosocial model; the idea of being more humble with science and using "theoretical" more often; the problems with microdosing trials; and the issues with evidence: If there isn't sufficient evidence, why isn't there? And what exactly would be sufficient?

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