The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Exploring SaaS Success, AI Trends, and Business Challenges in 2025 with River Consultancy Group

Exploring SaaS Success, AI Trends, and Business Challenges in 2025 with River Consultancy Group Riverconsultancygroup.co.uk About the Guest(s): James Lawson is the founder and Chief Executive of River Consulting Group, a leader in the domain of customer success. With over 25 years of experience in the SaaS industry, he has built his expertise through roles at companies like Oracle. James is known for his strategic problem-solving skills and has been an advocate for a customer-centric approach in technology consultancy. Denny Burda is the Chief Commercial Officer at River Consulting Group, where he plays a pivotal role in transforming client relationships and business operations. His career began in the nonprofit sector, working in social work, which has given him a unique perspective on customer interactions in the tech world. Denny's approach combines customer success strategies with commercial insight to drive business growth. Episode Summary: In this engaging episode of The Chris Voss Show, hosts Chris Voss, James Lawson, and Denny Burda dive into the world of SaaS and explore the future trajectory of this dynamic industry. With a combined expertise in customer success and commercial strategy, James and Denny share their insights into combating SaaS challenges and fostering sustainable growth. Listeners will learn about innovative solutions for addressing poor employee engagement, misaligned business transformations, and the evolving roles within SaaS organizations. James Lawson and Denny Burda discuss the potential impact of AI on the SaaS landscape by 2025, arguing for a balanced approach to technological adoption. They emphasize the importance of not over-investing without strategic purpose, comparing AI to the advent of the word processor and the personal computer. Their prediction centers around creating a lean and customer-centric business model that thrives on simplicity and eliminates the traditional reliance on a sales force. Hear firsthand their revolutionary "Build the CAT" program and how it aims to align business processes with customer success, ensuring tangible and repeatable growth metrics. Key Takeaways: The evolution of AI is changing SaaS; successful companies must adopt AI strategically rather than jumping on the bandwagon blindly. There's a growing shift towards relying less on traditional sales forces and more on customer success methodologies to drive predictable growth. The “Build the CAT” approach emphasizes leveraging existing customer bases to scale SaaS offerings without extensive sales efforts. By 2025, the industry will likely pivot towards simpler, more effective solutions rather than over-engineered innovations. Human connection and interaction remain critical, even as AI evolves; businesses must balance tech tools with genuine customer engagements. Notable Quotes: "A business is perfectly built to get the output that it gets." – James Lawson "Technology's always gonna be coming; you've always gotta adapt and evolve to it." – Denny Burda "We are trying to kill sales culture because sales culture at its core says, I'm gonna go out and get what I can for me." – Denny Burda "There's layering to it that is often not spoken about because these are all subjects that require research around." – James Lawson "AI is really just a new iteration of that complex of art imitating life." – Denny Burda BIOs James Lawson Founder, Chief Executive Officer James started life as a DBA back in the late 1990’s and despite the recurring cron job nightmares made the decision to move into customer success at the beginning of its inception. Both luck and persistence never left his soul as he found himself working for some of the biggest and fastest growing tech firms in the world, including a little place called Oracle. This is where his life ultimately changed and he stepped onto the fast track of learning the world of M&A, Sales and Customer Success (all the hard way). In each tenure, James and his team grew key metrics substantially and had consistently been asked to privately consult with some of the leading CEO advisory firms in the world. It only took his daughter, aged 5 at the time, to say “why don’t you do this all yourself?” Shortly after, he left his role as VP of Customer Success at Litera and started River Consultancy Group, named after his daughter, River. Within only 15 months, the group became one of the most sought after advisory services in the UK for business growth, customer success, and executive mentorship with over 80 clients ranging from small business to enterprise, 100+ mentored leaders, and deep connections within all services in SaaS. Denny Burda Chief Commercial Officer Denny started his professional career working in non-profits driven by a strong desire to help others and bring about change in his community. When the time came to make a change he found an exciting new opportunity in the brand new Customer Success field and found that his desire to help others succeed and leading community change fit great into the role. As time went on he had the privilege of working with some of the largest companies on the planet achieving key strategic goals and succeeding in initiatives that have had a global impact today. In his last role as a Global Head of CS Denny got the opportunity to work with James and the two found an immediate connection and passion for helping others. When James decided to start River Consultancy Group a few years later Denny jumped at the opportunity to support in the setup and strategy for the group. A short 6 months after it started Denny joined officially as CCO to support our growing group of executive advisory clients and to lead our Build the CAT GTM strategy training.