Neurosalience #S6E9 with John Allen - Treating depression: From EEG asymmetry to neuromodulation

“It’s not a depression prevention plan, it’s a life improvement plan. It’s a whole…”

Dr. John Allen is a Distinguished Professor of Psychology, Cognitive Science, and Neuroscience at the University of Arizona. He received his PhD in 1991 from the University of Minnesota, specializing in psychophysiology and biological measurement, and joined the Arizona faculty in 1992. A leading figure in psychophysiology and mood and anxiety disorders, John is known for his pioneering work on frontal EEG alpha asymmetry as a biomarker for emotional processing and depression risk. His research spans the etiology and treatment of depression, the integration of fMRI with autonomic nervous system measures to study brain-body interactions, and the development of novel interventions grounded in the neurobiology of emotional disorders—including transcranial ultrasound, EEG biofeedback, and transcranial stimulation techniques.

In this episode, Peter and John trace John's path into psychology and his focus on mood and anxiety disorders. They discuss the significance of EEG asymmetry as an indicator of depression and explore the need for transdiagnostic approaches to mental health. The conversation delves into the potential of neuromodulation techniques—including psilocybin therapy and focused ultrasound—for treating depression, and examines the broader intersection of neuroscience, physiology, psychology, and technology in mental health treatment. They also touch on the challenges of translating research into clinical practice and the emerging role of AI in mental health assessment.

We hope you enjoy this episode!

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction to John Allen and His Work

05:26 - John's Journey into Psychology

16:44 - Understanding EEG Asymmetry and Its Depression

23:08 - Transdiagnostic Approaches to Mental Health

26:32 - Exploring Neuromodulation and Psilocybin

30:34 - Focused Ultrasound for Depression Treatment

42:25 - The Future of Mental Health Interventions

46:39 - Translating Research into Clinical Practice

51:14 - The Role of Technology in Mental Health Interventions

58:14 - AI’s Potential in Mental Health Assessment

01:03:40 - Advice for Aspiring Neuropsychologists

Works mentioned:

16:30 - Stewart et al. (2010). Resting frontal EEG asymmetry as an endophenotype for depression risk: Sex-specific patterns of frontal brain asymmetry. https://doi.org/10.1037/a0019196

18:00 - Coan et al. (2006). A capability model of individual differences in frontal EEG asymmetry. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.biopsycho.2005.10.003

29:00 - Moreno et al. (2006). Safety, tolerability, and efficacy of psilocybin in 9 patients with obsessive-compulsive disorder. https://doi.org/10.4088/jcp.v67n1110

31:00 - Schachtner et al. (2025). An open-label trial of stereotactic, non-invasive transcranial focused ultrasound targeting the default mode network for the treatment of depression. https://doi.org/10.3389/fpsyt.2025.1451828

54:07 - Lord et al. (2024). Transcranial focused ultrasound to the posterior cingulate cortex modulates default mode network and subjective experience: an fMRI pilot study. https://doi.org/10.3389/fnhum.2024.1392199

01:01:17 - Kaplan et al. (2025). AI and the coming mental health zombie apocalypse. https://doi.org/10.1038/s41380-025-03323-3

Producer’s note:

We ran into some technical issues with John's video, so you'll see captions in place of his footage throughout the episode. Audio quality is all good though! Thanks for understanding, and enjoy the conversation.

Episode producers:

Xuqian Michelle Li