Deep State Rebels v. Trump (with Michael Lewis)

Michael Lewis, the New York Times bestselling author of "Moneyball" and "The Big Short," stops by the studio to talk to Lovett about "Blockers: Rebels in the Deep State," his latest book on the government employees who stood up to Elon Musk and Donald Trump during the heyday of DOGE.

Lovett and Lewis revisit the story of Colin O'Brien, the security chief who locked DOGE out of the U.S. Institute of Peace, and break down how Howard Lutnick's takeover of the Commerce Department reveals the inner workings of Trump's government.

Then, Lewis shares what essential government employees told him about working under DOGE, why he thinks DOGE may have been created in the first place, and how the next Democratic candidate should make rebuilding the government a top message following DOGE's damage.

Hate listening to ads? Become a Friends of the Pod subscriber for ad-free episodes of Pod Save America, Pod Save the World, Lovett or Leave It, Runaway Country, Offline with Jon Favreau, and more—plus exclusive content, including bonus episodes of Pod Save America. Subscribe now at crooked.com/friends, on Apple Podcasts, or through the Pod Save America YouTube channel.

You can request a transcript by emailing transcripts@crooked.com. Include the podcast name, episode title, and air date. Please allow 48 hours for delivery.

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