JSJ 341: Testing in JavaScript with Gil Tayar
JavaScript Jabber27 Marras 2018

JSJ 341: Testing in JavaScript with Gil Tayar

Panel:
  • Aimee Knight
  • AJ O’Neal
  • Charles Max Wood
Special Guest: Gil Tayar In this episode, the panel talks with Gil Tayar who is currently residing in Tel Aviv and is a software engineer. He is currently the Senior Architect at Applitools in Israel. The panel and the guest talk about the different types of tests and when/how one is to use a certain test in a particular situation. They also mention Node, React, Selenium, Puppeteer, and much more!Show Topics:0:00 – Advertisement: KENDO UI 0:35 – Chuck: Our panel is AJ, Aimee, myself – and our special guest is Gil Tayar. Tell us why you are famous!1:13 – Gil talks about where he resides and his background. 2:27 – Chuck: What is the landscape like now with testing and testing tools now?2:39 – Guest: There is a huge renaissance with the JavaScript community. Testing has moved forward in the frontend and backend. Today we have lots of testing tools. We can do frontend testing that wasn’t possible 5 years ago. The major change was React.The guest talks about Node, React, tools, and more!4:17 – Aimee: I advocate for tests and testing. There is a grey area though...how do you treat that? If you have to get something into production, but it’s not THE thing to get into production, does that fall into product or...what?5:02 – Guest: We decided to test everything in the beginning. We actually cam through and did that and since then I don’t think I can use the right code without testing. There are a lot of different situations, though, to consider.The guest gives hypothetical situations that people could face. 6:27 – Aimee.6:32 – Guest: The horror to changing code without tests, I don’t know, I haven’t done that for a while. You write with fear in your heart. Your design is driven by fear, and not what you think is right. In the beginning don’t write those tests, but...7:22 – Aimee: I totally agree and I could go on and on and on.7:42 – Panel: I want to do tests when I know they will create value. I don’t want to do it b/c it’s a mundane thing. Secondly, I find that some times I am in a situation where I cannot write the test b/c I would have to know the business logic is correct. I am in this discovery mode of what is the business logic? I am not just building your app.I guess I just need advice in this area, I guess.8:55 – Guest gives advice to panelist’s question. He mentions how there are two schools of thought.10:20 – Guest: Don’t mock too much.10:54 – Panel: Are unit tests the easiest? I just reach for unit testing b/c it helps me code faster. But 90% of my code is NOT that.11:18 – Guest: Exactly! Most of our test is glue – gluing together a bunch of different stuff! Those are best tested as a medium-sized integration suite.12:39 – Panel: That seems like a lot of work, though! I loathe the database stuff b/c they don’t map cleanly. I hate this database stuff.13:06 – Guest: I agree, but don’t knock the database, but knock the level above the database.13:49 – Guest: Yes, it takes time! Building the script and the testing tools, but when you have it then adding to it is zero time. Once you are in the air it’s smooth sailing.14:17 – Panel: I guess I can see that. I like to do the dumb-way the first time. I am not clear on the transition.14:47 – Guest: Write the code, and then write the tests.The guest gives a hypothetical situation on how/when to test in a certain situation. 16:25 – Panel: Can you talk about that more, please?16:50 – Guest: Don’t have the same unit – do browser and business logic stuff separated. The real business logic stuff needs to be above that level. First principle is separation of concerns.18:04 – Panel talks about dependency interjection and asks a question. 18:27 – Guest: What I am talking about very, very light inter-dependency interjection.19:19 – Panel: You have a main function and you are doing requires in the main function. You are passing the pieces of that into the components that need it.19:44 – Guest: I only do it when it’s necessary; it’s not a religion for me. I do it only for those layers that I know will need to be mocked; like database layers, etc.20:09 – Panel.20:19 – Guest: It’s taken me 80 years to figure out, but I have made plenty of mistakes a long the way. A test should run for 2-5 minutes max for package.20:53 – Panel: What if you have a really messy legacy system? How do you recommend going into that? Do you write tests for things that you think needs to get tested?21:39 – Guest answers the question and mentions Selenium! 24:27 – Panel: I like that approach.24:35 – Chuck: When you say integration test what do you mean?24:44 – Guest: Integration tests aren’t usually talked about. For most people it’s tests that test the database level against the database. For me, the integration tests are taking a set of classes as they are in the application and testing them together w/o the...so they can run in millisecond time.26:54 – Advertisement – Sentry.io 27:52 – Chuck: How much do the tools matter?28:01 – Guest: The revolutions matter. Whether you use Jasmine or Mocha or whatever I don’t think it matters. The tests matter not the tools.28:39 – Aimee: Yes and no. I think some tools are outdated.28:50 – Guest: I got a lot of flack about my blog where I talk about Cypress versus Selenium. I will never use Jasmine. In the end it’s the29:29 – Aimee: I am curious would you be willing to expand on what the Selenium folks were saying about Puppeteer and others may not provide?29:54 – Guest: Cypress was built for frontend developers. They don’t care about cross browser, and they tested in Chrome. Most browsers are typically the same. Selenium was built with the QA mindset – end to end tests that we need to do cross browser.The guest continues with this topic.30:54 – Aimee mentions Cypress. 31:08 – Guest: My guessing is that their priority is not there. I kind of agree with them.31:21 – Aimee: I think they are focusing on mobile more.31:24 – Guest: I think cross browser testing is less of an issue now. There is one area that is important it’s the visual area! It’s important to test visually across these different browsers.32:32 – Guest: Selenium is a Swiss knife – it can do everything.33:32 – Chuck: I am thinking about different topics to talk about. I haven’t used Puppeteer. What’s that about?33:49 – Guest: Puppeteer is much more like Selenium. The reason why it’s great is b/c Puppeteer will always be Google Chrome. 35:42 – Chuck: When should you be running your tests? I like to use some unit tests when I am doing my development but how do you break that down?36:06 – Guest.38:30 – Chuck: You run tests against production?38:45 – Guest: Don’t run tests against production...let me clarify!39:14 – Chuck.39:21 – Guest: When I am talking about integration testing in the backend...40:37 – Chuck asks a question. 40:47 – Guest: I am constantly running between frontend and backend.I didn’t know how to run tests for frontend. I had to invent a new thing and I “invented” the package JS DONG. It’s an implementation of Dong in Node. I found out that I wasn’t the only one and that there were others out there, too.43:14 – Chuck: Nice! You talked in the prep docs that you urged a new frontend developer to not run the app in the browser for 2 months?43:25 – Guest: Yeah, I found out that she was running the application...she said she knew how to write tests. I wanted her to see it my way and it probably was a radical train-of-thought, and that was this...44:40 – Guest: Frontend is so visual.45:12 – Chuck: What are you working on now?45:16 – Guest: I am working with Applitools and I was impressed with what they were doing.The guest goes into further detail.46:08 – Guest: Those screenshots are never the same.48:36 – Panel: It’s...comparing the output to the static site to the...48:50 – Guest: Yes, that static site – if you have 30 pages in your app – most of those are the same. We have this trick where we don’t upload it again and again. Uploading the whole static site is usually very quick. The second thing is we don’t wait for the results. We don’t wait for the whole rendering and we continue with the

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HTMX and InterCooler ft. Carson Gross - JSJ 513

HTMX and InterCooler ft. Carson Gross - JSJ 513

Carson Gross is the creator of InterCooler and HTMX. He pulled them together to manage the way that he wrote JavaScript and interacted with hypermedia and HATEOAS to make managing the DOM and backend easier.It's not really a competitor to web frameworks as much as a different way to think about the front-end of your application.PanelAJ O'NealDan ShappirGuestCarson GrossSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Raygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trialTop End DevsLinks///_hyperscript</>htmx - high power tools for htmlTwitter: htmx.org ( @htmx_org )PicksAJ- Eta | EtaAJ- FastifyAJ- Creeds of CraftsmanshipCarson- ///_hyperscriptSpecial Guest: Carson Gross.Sponsored By:Top End Devs: Learn to Become a Top 5% Developer. Join our community of ambitious and engaged programmers to learn how.Raygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

14 Joulu 20211h 12min

Virtual DOM and the React Way, Part 1 - JSJ 512

Virtual DOM and the React Way, Part 1 - JSJ 512

Dan Shappir takes the lead in explaining React's core design, and how it's enabled by the Virtual DOM (VDOM). The panel discusses what the VDOM is, and how it differs from the actual browser DOM. Also how React leverages the VDOM and its reconciliation mechanism. Understanding these concepts is important in order to properly understand and make the best use of React.PanelAJ O'NealCharles Max WoodDan ShappirSteve EdwardsSponsorsTop End DevsCoaching | Top End DevsPicksAJ- Jordan Walke - React to the Future - YouTubeAJ- Tribal LeadershipAJ- The Innovator's SolutionAJ- A Meditation for Healthful SleepAJ- CreedsOfCraftsmanship.comCharles- AntibioticsCharles- Podcast | Top End DevsCharles- Author | Top End DevsDan- Typing the Technical Interview in TypeScriptSteve- Random Phrase GeneratorSponsored By:Coaching | Top End Devs: Do you want to level up your career? or go freelance? or start a podcast or youtube channel? Let Charles Max Wood Help You Achieve Your DreamsTop End Devs: Learn to Become a Top 5% Developer. Join our community of ambitious and engaged programmers to learn how.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

7 Joulu 20211h 11min

Catching Up on InertiaJS with Jonathan Reinink - JSJ 511

Catching Up on InertiaJS with Jonathan Reinink - JSJ 511

Steve and AJ catch up with Jonathan Reinink, the creator of InertiaJS, a utility for seamlessly connecting front end Javascript frameworks with back ends to create a seamless and performant web app monolith. They discuss TailwindCSS and Jonathan’s work at Tailwind Labs, and then get into InertiaJS, how it works, and many of the different features. They also discuss the new SSR capability currently in private beta, and Inertia’s growing inclusion into other frameworks, such as Laravel Breeze and Laravel Jetstream.PanelAJ O'NealSteve EdwardsGuestJonathan ReininkSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Raygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trialTop End DevsLinksJavaScript Jabber: JSJ 443: All About InertiaJS with Jonathan ReininkJonathanReinink - Web designer & developerTwitter: Jonathan Reinink ( @reinink )PicksAJ- Laws of UXAJ- <input type="datetime-local"> - HTML: HyperText Markup Language | MDNAJ- Creeds of CraftsmanshipJonathan- Tailwind UISteve- Dad Jokes by Pubity - InstagramSteve- Dad Jokes - InstagramSpecial Guest: Jonathan Reinink.Sponsored By:Top End Devs: Learn to Become a Top 5% Developer. Join our community of ambitious and engaged programmers to learn how.Raygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

30 Marras 20211h 20min

BONUS: How to do LARGE Volumes of HIGH Quality Work - While Spending Fewer Hours Working

BONUS: How to do LARGE Volumes of HIGH Quality Work - While Spending Fewer Hours Working

Get the Black Friday/Cyber Monday "Double Your Productivity by 5pm Today" Deal Coupon Code: "DEEP" for a GIANT discountMani provides us with strategies and tactics to get Deep Work time and how to get our minds into that focused state for hours at a time.He has read hundreds of books that have taught him the secrets to getting more done by getting into this state.He starts by telling us how he was passed over for a promotion at Qualcomm in favor of someone younger and less experienced and how that inspired him to figure out what the other guy was doing differently. He learned that he needed to get more done with the time he was spending on his projects.The trick? Deep Work!Deep Work is the ability to spend uninterrupted, focused time on a task to bend your entire mind toward the goal.Other developers call it "Flow" or "the Zone."Mani provides us with strategies and tactics to get Deep Work time and how to get our minds into that focused state for hours at a time. Get the Black Friday/Cyber Monday "Double Your Productivity by 5pm Today" Deal Coupon Code: "DEEP" for a GIANT discount Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

24 Marras 202147min

Do You Have Dev FOMO? ft. Yoav Ganbar - JSJ 510

Do You Have Dev FOMO? ft. Yoav Ganbar - JSJ 510

Yoav Ganbar joins the Jabber crew to discuss Dev FOMO. He leads the panel through a discussion about adopting technologies and knowing about new niches. The panel discusses how to stay on top of the movements in our ecosystem and when we should prioritize other things.PanelAimee KnightAJ O'NealCharles Max WoodDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestYoav GanbarSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Top End DevsCoaching | Top End DevsLinksGitHub: Yoav Ganbar ( hamatoyogi )LinkedIn: Yoav GanbarTwitter: Yoav Ganbar ( @HamatoYogi )PicksAimee- What is SSH Tunneling, SSH Reverse Tunneling and SSH Port Forwarding? | TeleportAimee- Why Does Quantitative Easing Benefit the Rich?AJ- GitHub - ulid/spec: The canonical spec for ulidAJ- Jake Archibald on TwitterAJ- GitHub - Creeds of CraftsmanshipCharles- The Search for Planet XCharles- Author | Top End DevsDan- Core Web Vitals Technology ReportDan- The Kite Runner by Khaled HosseiniSteve- The wholly pun bible | InstagramSteve- The wholly pun bible | InstagramYoav- Zack JacksonYoav- Next.js Conf 2021Yoav- daily.devSpecial Guest: Yoav Ganbar.Sponsored By:Coaching | Top End Devs: Do you want to level up your career? or go freelance? or start a podcast or youtube channel? Let Charles Max Wood Help You Achieve Your DreamsTop End Devs: Learn to Become a Top 5% Developer. Join our community of ambitious and engaged programmers to learn how.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

23 Marras 20211h 20min

SEO for Developers ft. Mordy Oberstein - JSJ 509

SEO for Developers ft. Mordy Oberstein - JSJ 509

Mordy Oberstein joins the JavaScript Jabber panel to discuss SEO and how what seems like a marketing concern is relevant and exciting for developers. SEO is working with a black box with regards to Google since Google and other search engines don't tell you anything about how they adjust their search algorithms.Mordy walks through how developers can contribute to the issues around showing up in search engine results.PanelAJ O'NealDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestMordy ObersteinSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Raygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trialTop End DevsLinksThe Best SEO Podcast for Tips & InsightsMordy Oberstein - FacebookPicksAJ- Better off Ted - Jabberwocky Project - YouTubeAJ- Rise of the RobotsAJ- The Economic SingularityAJ- Dangerous Wrongthinkers ( AlignPay and 2nd Amendment Processing )AJ- Creeds of CraftsmanshipDan- Google Is The Most Searched Word On BingDan- Have Single-Page Apps Ruined the Web? | Transitional Apps with Rich Harris, NYTimes - YouTubeMordy- For All Mankind | Apple TV+Steve- Best Practices (why I Hate Them)Steve- The wholly pun bible - InstagramSteve- Dad Jokes by Pubity - InstagramContact AJ:AJ ONealCoolAJ86 on GITBeyond Code BootcampBeyond Code Bootcamp | GitHubFollow Beyond Code Bootcamp | FacebookTwitter: Beyond Code Bootcamp ( @_beyondcode )coolaj86- TwitchContact Dan:GitHub: Dan Shappir ( DanShappir )LinkedIn: Dan ShappirTwitter: Dan Shappir ( @DanShappir )Contact Steve:Twitter: Steve Edwards ( @wonder95 )GitHub: Steve Edwards ( wonder95 )LinkedIn: Steve EdwardsSpecial Guest: Mordy Oberstein.Sponsored By:Top End Devs: Learn to Become a Top 5% Developer. Join our community of ambitious and engaged programmers to learn how.Raygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

16 Marras 20211h 8min

State Management ft. Assaf Krintza - JSJ 508

State Management ft. Assaf Krintza - JSJ 508

Assaf Krintza joins the JavaScript Jabber panel to discuss the various approaches and uses for state management in web applications. Some of the focus is on React, but many of the tools and approaches work in or have similar options in the other web frameworks.PanelAJ O'NealDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestAssaf KrintzaSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Dev Influencers AcceleratorLevel Up | Devchat.tvLinksLivecycleLinkedIn: Assaf KrintzaTwitter: Assaf Krintza ( @krinssaf )PicksAJ- Killers of the Flower MoonAJ- The Stormlight ArchiveAJ- The Lightbringer SeriesAssaf- Shadertoy BetaAssaf- Inigo Quilez - YouTubeDan- Dilvish, the DamnedDan- The Changing LandDan- Hobson's BrowserSteve- A Tunguska sized airburst destroyed Tall el-Hammam a Middle Bronze Age city in the Jordan Valley near the Dead SeaSteve- The wholly pun bible - InstagramSteve- The wholly pun bible - InstagramSteve- GitHub | elijahmanor/devpunContact AJ:AJ ONealCoolAJ86 on GITBeyond Code BootcampBeyond Code Bootcamp | GitHubFollow Beyond Code Bootcamp | FacebookTwitter: Beyond Code Bootcamp ( @_beyondcode )coolaj86- TwitchContact Dan:GitHub: Dan Shappir ( DanShappir )LinkedIn: Dan ShappirTwitter: Dan Shappir ( @DanShappir )Contact Steve:Twitter: Steve Edwards ( @wonder95 )GitHub: Steve Edwards ( wonder95 )LinkedIn: Steve EdwardsSpecial Guest: Assaf Krintza.Sponsored By:Top End Devs Coaching: If you have questions about how to grow your skills or take your career to the next level, join us on our next weekly coaching call. It's completely free.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

9 Marras 20211h 4min

D3 and Data Visualization ft. Ian Johnson - JSJ 507

D3 and Data Visualization ft. Ian Johnson - JSJ 507

Ian Johnson is a former Google UX engineer and data visualization engineer with ObservableHQ building data visualizations with JavaScript. He works on both the tools and the visualizations built with D3 on the web. He discusses how to use tools like D3 to tell a story using your data.PanelDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestIan JohnsonSponsorsShortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io)Raygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trialDev Influencers AcceleratorLinksObservableDrawing with DataScales / Observable PlotTwitter: Ian Johnson ( @enjalot )PicksDan- Apple’s Browser Engine Ban Is Holding Back Web App Innovation – The New StackIan- Bret Victor, beast of burdenIan- For ExampleIan- Bret Victor - Inventing on Principle - YouTubeSteve- Dad Jokes on InstagramSteve- Dad Jokes by PubityContact Dan:GitHub: Dan Shappir ( DanShappir )LinkedIn: Dan ShappirTwitter: Dan Shappir ( @DanShappir )Contact Steve:Twitter: Steve Edwards ( @wonder95 )GitHub: Steve Edwards ( wonder95 )LinkedIn: Steve EdwardsSpecial Guest: Ian Johnson.Sponsored By:Raygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Shortcut (formerly Clubhouse.io): Your project management tool should be a breeze to setup, at least mildly enjoyable to use, and help evolve your already existing development workflows so it's easier to get things done. Does that describe your current tool? If it does, great! You can stop reading. If not, then Shortcut (formerly known as Clubhouse) could be the perfect fit. We're project management built specifically for software teams and we're fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. Delight the grumpiest scrum masters with Shortcut.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

2 Marras 202159min

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