JSJ 341: Testing in JavaScript with Gil Tayar
JavaScript Jabber27 Marras 2018

JSJ 341: Testing in JavaScript with Gil Tayar

Panel:
  • Aimee Knight
  • AJ O’Neal
  • Charles Max Wood
Special Guest: Gil Tayar In this episode, the panel talks with Gil Tayar who is currently residing in Tel Aviv and is a software engineer. He is currently the Senior Architect at Applitools in Israel. The panel and the guest talk about the different types of tests and when/how one is to use a certain test in a particular situation. They also mention Node, React, Selenium, Puppeteer, and much more!Show Topics:0:00 – Advertisement: KENDO UI 0:35 – Chuck: Our panel is AJ, Aimee, myself – and our special guest is Gil Tayar. Tell us why you are famous!1:13 – Gil talks about where he resides and his background. 2:27 – Chuck: What is the landscape like now with testing and testing tools now?2:39 – Guest: There is a huge renaissance with the JavaScript community. Testing has moved forward in the frontend and backend. Today we have lots of testing tools. We can do frontend testing that wasn’t possible 5 years ago. The major change was React.The guest talks about Node, React, tools, and more!4:17 – Aimee: I advocate for tests and testing. There is a grey area though...how do you treat that? If you have to get something into production, but it’s not THE thing to get into production, does that fall into product or...what?5:02 – Guest: We decided to test everything in the beginning. We actually cam through and did that and since then I don’t think I can use the right code without testing. There are a lot of different situations, though, to consider.The guest gives hypothetical situations that people could face. 6:27 – Aimee.6:32 – Guest: The horror to changing code without tests, I don’t know, I haven’t done that for a while. You write with fear in your heart. Your design is driven by fear, and not what you think is right. In the beginning don’t write those tests, but...7:22 – Aimee: I totally agree and I could go on and on and on.7:42 – Panel: I want to do tests when I know they will create value. I don’t want to do it b/c it’s a mundane thing. Secondly, I find that some times I am in a situation where I cannot write the test b/c I would have to know the business logic is correct. I am in this discovery mode of what is the business logic? I am not just building your app.I guess I just need advice in this area, I guess.8:55 – Guest gives advice to panelist’s question. He mentions how there are two schools of thought.10:20 – Guest: Don’t mock too much.10:54 – Panel: Are unit tests the easiest? I just reach for unit testing b/c it helps me code faster. But 90% of my code is NOT that.11:18 – Guest: Exactly! Most of our test is glue – gluing together a bunch of different stuff! Those are best tested as a medium-sized integration suite.12:39 – Panel: That seems like a lot of work, though! I loathe the database stuff b/c they don’t map cleanly. I hate this database stuff.13:06 – Guest: I agree, but don’t knock the database, but knock the level above the database.13:49 – Guest: Yes, it takes time! Building the script and the testing tools, but when you have it then adding to it is zero time. Once you are in the air it’s smooth sailing.14:17 – Panel: I guess I can see that. I like to do the dumb-way the first time. I am not clear on the transition.14:47 – Guest: Write the code, and then write the tests.The guest gives a hypothetical situation on how/when to test in a certain situation. 16:25 – Panel: Can you talk about that more, please?16:50 – Guest: Don’t have the same unit – do browser and business logic stuff separated. The real business logic stuff needs to be above that level. First principle is separation of concerns.18:04 – Panel talks about dependency interjection and asks a question. 18:27 – Guest: What I am talking about very, very light inter-dependency interjection.19:19 – Panel: You have a main function and you are doing requires in the main function. You are passing the pieces of that into the components that need it.19:44 – Guest: I only do it when it’s necessary; it’s not a religion for me. I do it only for those layers that I know will need to be mocked; like database layers, etc.20:09 – Panel.20:19 – Guest: It’s taken me 80 years to figure out, but I have made plenty of mistakes a long the way. A test should run for 2-5 minutes max for package.20:53 – Panel: What if you have a really messy legacy system? How do you recommend going into that? Do you write tests for things that you think needs to get tested?21:39 – Guest answers the question and mentions Selenium! 24:27 – Panel: I like that approach.24:35 – Chuck: When you say integration test what do you mean?24:44 – Guest: Integration tests aren’t usually talked about. For most people it’s tests that test the database level against the database. For me, the integration tests are taking a set of classes as they are in the application and testing them together w/o the...so they can run in millisecond time.26:54 – Advertisement – Sentry.io 27:52 – Chuck: How much do the tools matter?28:01 – Guest: The revolutions matter. Whether you use Jasmine or Mocha or whatever I don’t think it matters. The tests matter not the tools.28:39 – Aimee: Yes and no. I think some tools are outdated.28:50 – Guest: I got a lot of flack about my blog where I talk about Cypress versus Selenium. I will never use Jasmine. In the end it’s the29:29 – Aimee: I am curious would you be willing to expand on what the Selenium folks were saying about Puppeteer and others may not provide?29:54 – Guest: Cypress was built for frontend developers. They don’t care about cross browser, and they tested in Chrome. Most browsers are typically the same. Selenium was built with the QA mindset – end to end tests that we need to do cross browser.The guest continues with this topic.30:54 – Aimee mentions Cypress. 31:08 – Guest: My guessing is that their priority is not there. I kind of agree with them.31:21 – Aimee: I think they are focusing on mobile more.31:24 – Guest: I think cross browser testing is less of an issue now. There is one area that is important it’s the visual area! It’s important to test visually across these different browsers.32:32 – Guest: Selenium is a Swiss knife – it can do everything.33:32 – Chuck: I am thinking about different topics to talk about. I haven’t used Puppeteer. What’s that about?33:49 – Guest: Puppeteer is much more like Selenium. The reason why it’s great is b/c Puppeteer will always be Google Chrome. 35:42 – Chuck: When should you be running your tests? I like to use some unit tests when I am doing my development but how do you break that down?36:06 – Guest.38:30 – Chuck: You run tests against production?38:45 – Guest: Don’t run tests against production...let me clarify!39:14 – Chuck.39:21 – Guest: When I am talking about integration testing in the backend...40:37 – Chuck asks a question. 40:47 – Guest: I am constantly running between frontend and backend.I didn’t know how to run tests for frontend. I had to invent a new thing and I “invented” the package JS DONG. It’s an implementation of Dong in Node. I found out that I wasn’t the only one and that there were others out there, too.43:14 – Chuck: Nice! You talked in the prep docs that you urged a new frontend developer to not run the app in the browser for 2 months?43:25 – Guest: Yeah, I found out that she was running the application...she said she knew how to write tests. I wanted her to see it my way and it probably was a radical train-of-thought, and that was this...44:40 – Guest: Frontend is so visual.45:12 – Chuck: What are you working on now?45:16 – Guest: I am working with Applitools and I was impressed with what they were doing.The guest goes into further detail.46:08 – Guest: Those screenshots are never the same.48:36 – Panel: It’s...comparing the output to the static site to the...48:50 – Guest: Yes, that static site – if you have 30 pages in your app – most of those are the same. We have this trick where we don’t upload it again and again. Uploading the whole static site is usually very quick. The second thing is we don’t wait for the results. We don’t wait for the whole rendering and we continue with the

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Jaksot(735)

JSJ 480: Are Micro Frontends worth the effort? (And if so when?)

JSJ 480: Are Micro Frontends worth the effort? (And if so when?)

Micro frontends are the topic of discussion again, this time with Grgur Grisogono, Principal Consultant at Modus Create and co-author of the Manning book "Ext JS in Action". In particular, Grgur explains the new module federation capabilities introduced by Webpack, and describes how they can be used to construct micro frontends in a much more streamlined and modular fashion.PanelAJ O'NealCharles Max WoodDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestGrgur GrisogonoSponsorsDev Influencers AcceleratorRaygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trial JavaScript Error and Performance Monitoring | SentryLinksModule Federation | webpackTwitter: Grgur Grisogono ( @ggrgur )PicksAJ- Jim Kwik 10 Morning HabitsAJ- Wayne Brady's Comedy IQAJ- Beyond Code GmbH | FacebookAJ- Beyond Code Bootcamp | YouTubeAJ- Twitter: Beyond Code Bootcamp ( @_beyondcode )AJ- Digital Ocean (2 Months or $100 Free)Charles- The 12 Week Year by Brian P. Moran and Michael Lennington Charles- TrainingPeaks | Hit Your StrideCharles- Phil's Beginner Marathon Plan ( 4-6hrs/wk )Charles- ClickUpDan- Smash BurgerDan- #JavaScriptRiddle | TwitterGrgur- YeastGrgur- Modus CreateGrgur- Modus Create, Inc. | YouTubeSteve- Intagram: ( pun_bible )Steve- Instagram: ( standup.trex )Special Guest: Grgur Grisogono.Sponsored By:Sentry: Resolve JavaScript errors and performance issues with SentryRaygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

20 Huhti 20211h 14min

BONUS: How Opportunities Come Your Way When You're an Influencer

BONUS: How Opportunities Come Your Way When You're an Influencer

Charles Max Wood discusses several opportunities that came his way early in his podcasting career and other opportunities that have come to other people after only a couple of podcast episodes. He explains why that happens and how you can use this to create more influence as a developer.PanelCharles Max WoodSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

16 Huhti 202120min

JSJ 479: Practical Microservices with Ethan Garofolo

JSJ 479: Practical Microservices with Ethan Garofolo

Ethan Garofolo is the author of Practical Microservices with Pragmatic Programmers. He starts out debunking the ideas behind pulling parts of a monolith into a different services and change function calls into HTTP calls. Instead, it's an approach that keeps things moving for development teams that solves several productivity issues. He breaks down the ways to move functionality around and which approaches make sense for breaking your application up into pieces that are easy to work on and approachable for multiple teams.PanelAimee KnightAJ O'NealSteve EdwardsGuestEthan GarofoloSponsorsDev Influencers AcceleratorJavaScript Error and Performance Monitoring | SentryLinksSuper Guitar BrosUnder Desk UREVO TreadmillPractical Microservices by Ethan GarofoloXKCD Flow ChartsEthan Garofolo Microservices - YouTubePicksAimee- The 3 Mindsets to Avoid as a Senior Software DeveloperAJ- The Movie Great Pyramid K 2019AJ- Postgres Cheat SheetAJ- Jim Kwik 10 Morning HabitsEthan- GitHub | message-db/message-dbEthan- Eventide ProjectEthan- GitHub | mpareja/gearshaftEthan- Unlock | Space CowboysEthan- Practical Microservices by Ethan GarofoloEthan- Practical MicroservicesSteve- Bytes by U;Special Guest: Ethan Garofolo.Sponsored By:Sentry: Resolve JavaScript errors and performance issues with SentrySupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

13 Huhti 20211h 17min

BONUS: What is Charles Max Wood's Biggest Payoff for Being a Dev Influencer?

BONUS: What is Charles Max Wood's Biggest Payoff for Being a Dev Influencer?

Charles Max Wood started podcasting because it sounded fun and because he wanted to talk about technology. He learned pretty quickly that it got him access to people who understood the things he wanted to learn. The reasons changed over the years, as Charles explains before he talks about the big payoff he gets now from doing the podcasts.PanelCharles Max WoodSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

9 Huhti 202131min

JSJ 478: Browser Standards Rampage: Can We Have Nice Things?

JSJ 478: Browser Standards Rampage: Can We Have Nice Things?

The infamous Jake Archibald, member of the Chrome Team, an author of the Service Worker spec, and host of the HTTP 203 Podcast takes us on a whirlwind tour of recent and upcoming browser standards including Portals, iframes, App Cache, Service Workers, HTML, Browser History and more - why they are the way they are, why we can't have nice things, and how we might get nice things anyway in the future. Lots of good back and forth and only a little name calling… jaffa…PanelAimee KnightAJ O'NealDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestJake ArchibaldSponsorsDexecureRaygun | Click here to get started on your free 14-day trialJavaScript Error and Performance Monitoring | SentryLinksPortalsGitHub streaming vs SPANewline delimited JSONAVIF compression articleHTTP 203The old 300ms tap delaySession history is confusing Spectre & MeltdownCOOP & COEP App history API proposalApplication cache is a douchebagExtensible web manifestoIDB promise libraryTwitter: Jake Archibald ( @jaffathecake )PicksAimee- On The Experience of Being Poor-ish, For People Who Aren'tAJ- HTTP 203 | YouTubeAJ- Mac OS X Lion CSS3 by Alessio AtzeniAJ- Worms WMDAJ- Deku Deals AJ- Final Fantasy IX (English) | playasiaAJ- RTMP setup in Nimble StreamerDan- The Sopranos Jake- It's a Sin Steve- An Interactive Guide to CSS Transitions Steve- Monty Python Spanish Inquisition Part 1Steve- Monty Python Spanish Inquisition Part 2Special Guest: Jake Archibald.Sponsored By:Dexecure: Exclusive Offer For Javascript Jabber Listeners Promo Code: DEXJSJAB Sentry: Resolve JavaScript errors and performance issues with SentryRaygun: Raygun now offers Real User Monitoring of Core Web Vitals. Start your 14-day free trial now.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

6 Huhti 20211h 25min

BONUS: How Jason Weimann Became a Game Developer

BONUS: How Jason Weimann Became a Game Developer

Jason Weimann started out as an enthusiast of the Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game, Everquest. After becoming a software developer and building a collaborative community playing the game, learn how he used his connections to get a job working for the company that made the game, even if it wasn't a job working as a game developer and how that led to a career working on one of the most popular online games of the time.PanelCharles Max WoodSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

2 Huhti 202139min

JSJ 477: Understanding Search Engines and SEO (for devs) - Part 2

JSJ 477: Understanding Search Engines and SEO (for devs) - Part 2

If you're building a website or web-app, there's a good chance that you want people to find it so that they will access it. These days this mostly means that you want it to appear in the relevant search engine results pages (SERP). In this episode we are joined by Martin Splitt, DevRel at Google for the Search & Web ecosystem, who explains in detail how search engines work, and what developers and SEOs need to know and do in order to be on their good side.PanelAimee KnightAJ O'NealDan ShappirSteve EdwardsGuestMartin SplittSponsorsDexecureDev Heroes AcceleratorJavaScript Error and Performance Monitoring | SentryLinksDevchat.tv | JSJ 428: The Alphabet Soup of Performance MeasurementsPicksAJ- What If?: Serious Scientific Answers to Absurd Hypothetical Questions by Randall MunroeAJ- How To: Absurd Scientific Advice for Common Real-World Problems by Randall MunroeAJ- Thing Explainer: Complicated Stuff in Simple Words by Randall MunroeAJ- From Microsoft, Oracle, etc to NSA Data Center (Google Map)AJ- Square Stone Wheel (Test Institute Stone and Stone Caveman User Focus Group)Dan- How to Systematically Debug Your CSS Just Like You Would Your JavaScript?Martin- The curious tale of Tegel’s Boeing 707Martin- Escaped cloned female mutant crayfish take over Belgian cemeteryMartin- Duke Graduate School Scientific Writing ResourceSteve- In Plain Sight (TV Series 2008-2012)Special Guest: Martin Splitt.Sponsored By:Sentry: Resolve JavaScript errors and performance issues with SentryDexecure: Exclusive Offer For Javascript Jabber Listeners Promo Code: DEXJSJAB Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/javascript-jabber/donationsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacyBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/javascript-jabber--6102064/support.

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BONUS: Continuing Your Learning Journey by Finding Mentors as an Influencer

BONUS: Continuing Your Learning Journey by Finding Mentors as an Influencer

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