#26 - Marie Gibbons on how exactly clean meat is made & what's needed to get it in every supermarket

#26 - Marie Gibbons on how exactly clean meat is made & what's needed to get it in every supermarket

First, decide on the type of animal. Next, pick the cell type. Then take a small, painless biopsy, and put the cells in a solution that makes them feel like they’re still in the body. Once the cells are in this comfortable state, they'll proliferate. One cell becomes two, two becomes four, four becomes eight, and so on. Continue until you have enough cells to make a burger, a nugget, a sausage, or a piece of bacon, then concentrate them until they bind into solid meat.

It's all surprisingly straightforward in principle according to Marie Gibbons​, a research fellow with The Good Food Institute, who has been researching how to improve this process at Harvard Medical School. We might even see clean meat sold commercially within a year.

The real technical challenge is developing large bioreactors and cheap solutions so that we can make huge volumes and drive down costs.

This interview covers the science and technology involved at each stage of clean meat production, the challenges and opportunities that face cutting-edge researchers like Marie, and how you could become one of them.

Full transcript, key points, and links to learn more.

Marie’s research focuses on turkey cells. But as she explains, with clean meat the possibilities extend well beyond those of traditional meat. Chicken, cow, pig, but also panda - and even dinosaurs could be on the menus of the future.

Today’s episode is hosted by Natalie Cargill, a barrister in London with a background in animal advocacy. Natalie and Marie also discuss:

* Why Marie switched from being a vet to developing clean meat
* For people who want to dedicate themselves to animal welfare, how does working in clean meat fare compared to other career options? How can people get jobs in the area?
* How did this become an established field?
* How important is the choice of animal species and cell type in this process?
* What are the biggest problems with current production methods?
* Is this kind of research best done in an academic setting, a commercial setting, or a balance between the two?
* How easy will it be to get consumer acceptance?
* How valuable would extra funding be for cellular agriculture?
* Can we use genetic modification to speed up the process?
* Is it reasonable to be sceptical of the possibility of clean meat becoming financially competitive with traditional meat any time in the near future?

Get this episode by subscribing to our podcast on the world’s most pressing problems and how to solve them: search for '80,000 Hours' in your podcasting app.

The 80,000 Hours Podcast is produced by Keiran Harris.

Jaksot(324)

#230 – Dean Ball on how AI is a huge deal — but we shouldn’t regulate it yet

#230 – Dean Ball on how AI is a huge deal — but we shouldn’t regulate it yet

Former White House staffer Dean Ball thinks it's very likely some form of 'superintelligence' arrives in under 20 years. He thinks AI being used for bioweapon research is "a real threat model, obvious...

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#229 – Marius Hobbhahn on the race to solve AI scheming before models go superhuman

#229 – Marius Hobbhahn on the race to solve AI scheming before models go superhuman

We often worry about AI models “hallucinating” or making honest mistakes. But what happens when a model knows the truth, but decides to deceive you anyway to achieve a goal of its own? This isn’t sci-...

3 Joulu 20253h 3min

Rob & Luisa chat kids, the 2016 fertility crash, and how the 50s invented parenting that makes us miserable

Rob & Luisa chat kids, the 2016 fertility crash, and how the 50s invented parenting that makes us miserable

Global fertility rates aren’t just falling: the rate of decline is accelerating. From 2006 to 2016, fertility dropped gradually, but since 2016 the rate of decline has increased 4.5-fold. In many weal...

25 Marras 20251h 59min

#228 – Eileen Yam on how we're completely out of touch with what the public thinks about AI

#228 – Eileen Yam on how we're completely out of touch with what the public thinks about AI

If you work in AI, you probably think it’s going to boost productivity, create wealth, advance science, and improve your life. If you’re a member of the American public, you probably strongly disagree...

20 Marras 20251h 43min

OpenAI: The nonprofit refuses to be killed (with Tyler Whitmer)

OpenAI: The nonprofit refuses to be killed (with Tyler Whitmer)

Last December, the OpenAI business put forward a plan to completely sideline its nonprofit board. But two state attorneys general have now blocked that effort and kept that board very much alive and k...

11 Marras 20251h 56min

#227 – Helen Toner on the geopolitics of AGI in China and the Middle East

#227 – Helen Toner on the geopolitics of AGI in China and the Middle East

With the US racing to develop AGI and superintelligence ahead of China, you might expect the two countries to be negotiating how they’ll deploy AI, including in the military, without coming to blows. ...

5 Marras 20252h 20min

#226 – Holden Karnofsky on unexploited opportunities to make AI safer — and all his AGI takes

#226 – Holden Karnofsky on unexploited opportunities to make AI safer — and all his AGI takes

For years, working on AI safety usually meant theorising about the ‘alignment problem’ or trying to convince other people to give a damn. If you could find any way to help, the work was frustrating an...

30 Loka 20254h 30min

#225 – Daniel Kokotajlo on what a hyperspeed robot economy might look like

#225 – Daniel Kokotajlo on what a hyperspeed robot economy might look like

When Daniel Kokotajlo talks to security experts at major AI labs, they tell him something chilling: “Of course we’re probably penetrated by the CCP already, and if they really wanted something, they c...

27 Loka 20252h 12min

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