Sinica Podcast19 Touko 2022

Too much of a good thing? Connectivity and the age of "unpeace," with the ECFR's Mark Leonard

This week on Sinica, Kaiser is joined by Mark Leonard, founder and director of the European Council on Foreign Relations and author most recently of The Age of Unpeace: How Connectivity Causes Conflict. Mark talks about how despite the bright promise that increasing connectedness — whether in trade, telecommunications, or movements of individuals — would usher in a world of better mutual understanding and enduring peace, the reality is that this connectedness has made the world more fractured and fractious. He explains how the three "empires of connectivity" — the U.S., China, and the EU — each leverage their extensive connectivity to advance their own interests. He also unpacks his assertion that the world is coming to share China's longstanding ambivalence toward connectedness.

1:05 – Kaiser tells how researching an abortive book project presaged Mark's conclusion that familiarity can breed contempt

7:58 – How Mark came to be a deep ambivalence about connectivity

16:03 – The three "empires of connectivity" and how they leverage or weaponize connectivity

31:41 – How all the connected empires are taking on "Chinese characteristics"

41:41 – How the Russo-Ukrainian War fits into Mark's framework in the book

51:49 – Chinese intellectuals and the shift in their thinking

A full transcript of this interview is available on SupChina.com.

Recommendations:

Mark: Chinese Hegemony: Grand Strategy and International Institutions in East Asian History by Zhang Feng

Kaiser: "A Teacher in China Learns the Limits of Free Expression," the latest piece by Peter Hessler in The New Yorker; and the Israeli spy thriller Tehran on AppleTV.

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