Lawfare Daily: The Double Black Box: Ashley Deeks on National Security AI
The Lawfare Podcast9 Heinä 2025

Lawfare Daily: The Double Black Box: Ashley Deeks on National Security AI

Lawfare Senior Editor Alan Rozenshtein sits down with Ashley Deeks, the Class of 1948 Professor of Scholarly Research in Law at the University of Virginia School of Law, to discuss her new book, “The Double Black Box: National Security, Artificial Intelligence, and the Struggle for Democratic Accountability.” They talk about the core metaphor of the book: the idea that the use of artificial intelligence in the national security space creates a "double black box." The first box is the traditional secrecy surrounding national security activities, and the second, inner box is the inscrutable nature of AI systems themselves, whose decision-making processes can be opaque even to their creators.

They also discuss how this double black box challenges traditional checks on executive power, including from Congress, the courts, and actors within the executive branch itself. They explore some of Deeks's proposals to pierce these boxes, the ongoing debate about whether AI can be coded to be more lawful than human decision-makers, and why the international regulation of national security AI is more likely to resemble the fraught world of cyber norms than the more structured regime of nuclear arms control.

Mentioned in this episode:

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Jaksot(2896)

Episode #73: Cmd. Mike Adams Talks Jus Extra Bellum

Episode #73: Cmd. Mike Adams Talks Jus Extra Bellum

Ben sat down with Cmd. Michael Adams, deputy legal adviser to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, at the Pacific Command conference in Manila this week, to talk about his new paper on "Jus Extr...

2 Touko 201434min

Episode #72: A Debate on the Future of the AUMF

Episode #72: A Debate on the Future of the AUMF

Ben Wittes and Rosa Brooks discuss the future of the AUMF at a panel moderated by Greg McNeal at Pepperdine University School of Law.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare. Hosted on Aca...

25 Huhti 20141h 5min

Episode #71: A Conversation with John Rizzo

Episode #71: A Conversation with John Rizzo

Benjamin Wittes interviews John Rizzo, former CIA acting general counsel, about his new book, Company Man, the persistence of the enhanced interrogation controversy, and the current debate over NSA su...

18 Huhti 201447min

Episode #70: Bruce Schneier on Technology and Privacy

Episode #70: Bruce Schneier on Technology and Privacy

Bruce Schneier of the Berkman Center for Internet and Society at Harvard Law School gave a keynote address on April 3, 2014 during the “National Security Agency at the Crossroads” conference at UT-Aus...

11 Huhti 201438min

Episode #69: A Conversation with Former NSA Deputy Director Chris Inglis

Episode #69: A Conversation with Former NSA Deputy Director Chris Inglis

This week, the University of Texas at Austin hosted a two day conference, "The National Security Agency at the Crossroads." Former NSA Deputy Director Chris Inglis gave an address; afterwards, Inglis ...

5 Huhti 201439min

Episode #68: John Carlin on Cybersecurity

Episode #68: John Carlin on Cybersecurity

John Carlin, the Acting Assistant Attorney General for National Security at the Department of Justice, gave a keynote address on cybersecurity at American University’s Washington College of Law.Suppor...

28 Maalis 201432min

Episode #67: An Address from NATO's Secretary General

Episode #67: An Address from NATO's Secretary General

On March 19, the Brookings Center on the United States and Europe (CUSE) hosted NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen for a Statesman’s Forum address on the importance of the transatlantic alli...

21 Maalis 20141h 5min

Episode #66: A Conversation with Shane Harris

Episode #66: A Conversation with Shane Harris

Shane Harris of Foreign Policy magazine sits down with Benjamin Wittes to discuss two major news events of the week: the CIA-SSCI flap and the back-and-forth between NSA and the courts over whether it...

14 Maalis 201441min

Suosittua kategoriassa Politiikka ja uutiset

uutiscast
aikalisa
ootsa-kuullut-tasta-2
politiikan-puskaradio
rss-ootsa-kuullut-tasta
tervo-halme
rss-vaalirankkurit-podcast
rss-podme-livebox
et-sa-noin-voi-sanoo-esittaa
rss-asiastudio
otetaan-yhdet
the-ulkopolitist
rss-hyvaa-huomenta-bryssel
rss-merja-mahkan-rahat
aihe
rikosmyytit
rss-kaikki-uusiksi
rss-raha-talous-ja-politiikka
rss-aijat-hopottaa-podcast
rss-polikulaari-pitka-kiekko-ja-muut-ts-podcastit