What Next: TBD | The A.I. Data Center Push That Wasn't

If you’re overwhelmed by the sheer volume of lawless acts, constitutional crises (we count five), and huge Trump administration losses in court this week - honestly, same. But if anyone can render this swirling storm of lawsuits and orders and injunctions legible, and put them in terms that can help make sense of this moment, it’s Dahlia Lithwick. On this week’s show, Dahlia is first joined by Quinta Jurecic, a fellow in Governance Studies at the Brookings Institution and a senior editor at Lawfare, to discuss the deeply worrying shift in the Trump regime’s posture toward judges and the rule of law, that’s been playing out inside and outside the courts this week. Next, Dahlia speaks with a lawyer who secured a big win against Elon Musk and DOGE this week in one of the USAID cases. Mimi Marziani explains the litigation strategy, and its limits.   Want more Amicus? Join Slate Plus to unlock weekly bonus episodes with exclusive legal analysis. Plus, you’ll access ad-free listening across all your favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the Amicus show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/amicusplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

22 Maalis 1h 16min

The National Institutes of Health is the primary engine of biomedical research around the world, which makes the Trump administration's dramatic cuts to its grant program both confusing and potentially incredibly harmful. Guest: Katherine J. Wu, staff writer for the Atlantic. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

21 Maalis 29min

This week, John Dickerson and David Plotz are joined by Ruth Marcus to discuss the showdown over mass deportation and the government’s defiant response to court orders; a deep data dive by Ezra Klein and David Shor about why Trump won the 2024 election; and this week’s so-called “negotiation” call between Trump and Putin. Listener chatter from Kevin in Portland, Oregon: Orb (Netflix) For this week’s Slate Plus bonus episode, John and David are joined by Ruth Marcus to discuss the arrest and prosecution of a Houston midwife this week under Texas’s near-total abortion ban. In the latest Gabfest Reads, David talks with author Adam Higginbotham about his new book, Challenger: A True Story of Heroism and Disaster on the Edge of Space. Email your chatters, questions, and comments to gabfest@slate.com. (Messages may be referenced by name unless the writer stipulates otherwise.) Podcast production by Kevin Bendis And Cheyna Roth Research by Emily Ditto Want more Political Gabfest? Join Slate Plus to unlock weekly bonus episodes. Plus, you’ll access ad-free listening across all your favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the Political Gabfest show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or visit slate.com/gabfestplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

20 Maalis 1h 5min

The economy that Donald Trump inherited from Joe Biden had low unemployment, slowing inflation, and a growing GDP. So what is he trying to achieve by imposing heavy tariffs on our allies and trading partners?  Guest: Stephanie Ruhle, NBC business analyst and the host of The 11th Hour with Stephanie Ruhle. Want more What Next? Join Slate Plus to unlock full, ad-free access to What Next and all your  other favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the What Next show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, Ethan Oberman, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

20 Maalis 29min

Mass deportations were a big part of Donald Trump’s 2024 presidential campaign and now in office, he’s making good on the wide-sweeping aspects of his policy, though the numbers aren’t yet massive. Most recently, he’s justified these actions through the 1798 Alien Enemies Act which only applies during wartime. When a judge attempted to halt the deportations to evaluate this use of the rarely-utilized law, Trump called for him to be impeached.  Guest: Michelle Hackman, U.S. immigration policy reporter in The Wall Street Journal's Washington bureau.  Want more What Next? Join Slate Plus to unlock full, ad-free access to What Next and all your  other favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the What Next show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, Ethan Oberman, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

19 Maalis 30min

In this urgent extra episode of Amicus,  host Dahlia Lithwick and Slate's senior writer Mark Joseph Stern discuss the unfolding constitutional crisis triggered by the Trump administration's defiance of a court order to halt flights carrying Venezuelan migrants to be delivered to El Salvador’s so-called Terrorism Confinement Center - a vast foreign prison  that could  be described as a labor camp.  Lithwick and Stern explore the timeline of events that unfolded in Federal Court Judge James Boasberg’s court this week, and on planes bound for El Salvador. Next, they try to parse the legal arguments put forth by the Justice Department, claiming apparently boundless power for President Trump to render anyone he deems a gang member. Finally, they discuss why the Trump administration has chosen this particular constitutional hill to die on, and how far Chief Justice John Roberts might be prepared to go along with it.  This episode is member-exclusive. Listen to it now by subscribing to Slate Plus. By joining, not only will you unlock weekly bonus episodes of Amicus—you’ll also access ad-free listening across all your favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the Amicus show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/amicusplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

18 Maalis 9min

In this Money Talks: How does America assert its power globally? The short answer is money. For the long answer, Felix Salmon calls in authors Edward Fishman (Chokepoints) and Saleha Mohsin (Paper Soldiers) who both recently published books on the subject. They’ll discuss how the US dollar managed to become the world’s reserve asset, the ways it’s been weaponized in the past, and what that global status means under an “America First” president.  This episode is member-exclusive. Listen to it now by subscribing to Slate Plus. By joining, not only will you unlock weekly bonus episodes of Slate Money—you’ll also access ad-free listening across all your favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the Slate Money show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/moneyplus to get access wherever you listen.  Podcast production by Jessamine Molli and Cheyna Roth. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

18 Maalis 40min

Educational, entertaining, and about as universally beloved as any part of American life, how did Sesame Street find itself cutting staff and searching for a new broadcasting home? Guest: David Kamp, author of Sunny Days: The Children's Television Revolution That Changed America Want more What Next? Join Slate Plus to unlock full, ad-free access to What Next and all your other favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the What Next show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, Ethan Oberman, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

18 Maalis 28min