Bonus: Don’t Cancel – Connect: Loretta J. Ross on Activism with Heart (276)

The Essence of Trauma-informed Therapy & Trauma-informed Parenting Harness the power of neuroscience. For parents and for therapists treating children and adults – learn more about the science of trauma and what heals. We are human, and we do have trauma, but maybe we need to look at being focused on relationships, connection, and curiosity about why this is happening. This discussion looks at how the connection is a biological imperative, and we’re always working towards building a relationship. Therapist Robyn Gobbel, LCSW joins co-host Sue Marriott LCSW, CGP for a discussion on breaking down the hardest parts of relationships and parenting. Robyn’s shares insights into the essence of trauma-informed therapy. She has developed online communities, as well as a podcast, all about helping parents who are dealing with these specific issues in practical application. We hope that her creative solutions will help you. Trauma-informed parenting is about connection. We need to focus on what it means to be human Who is Robyn Gobbel? Robyn Gobbel, MSW, RPT-S, loves coffee, P!NK, and everything about the brain. Once (recently!) her teenager went ballistic on her for getting ANOTHER (glitter!) coffee mug in the mail. Robyn loves cultivating deep, resonant connections with anyone who is up for it, as well as teaching anyone who will listen to harness the power of neuroscience so they can cultivate deep, resonant connections. What would change in the world if we could all do that? To see, be with, feel, and deeply know each other…and ourselves. Robyn thinks everything could change. Conversation includes resources on trauma-informed therapy and trauma-informed parenting: Changing how to provide mental health care to families. The importance of regulation AND connection. Working on a book about personal trauma healing The importance of understanding the relational neurobiology of being human. The importance of community for parents dealing with dysregulation and behavioral issues. Reducing the shame factor in much of trauma-informed therapy. Treatment of trauma-based behavioral issues. Virtual online clubs for parents who are struggling. Regulated, connected kids feel safe. Connected parents regulate by parenting in a way that feels “right”, not by following a technique. Resources on therapy and parenting kids with trauma: Robyn has free resources on her website https://icowellness.com/ Why do I get so dysregulated?  Check out Robyn’s podcast Online Club for Parents Haven’t gotten enough? https://therapistuncensored.com/episodes/tu27-raising-secure-children-with-guest-tina-payne-bryson/ https://therapistuncensored.com/episodes/tu53-complex-trauma-and-managing-dysregulation-with-guest-robyn-gobbel/ Tweet

10 Maalis 202153min

Attachment Through the Lifespan – Leading attachment researcher Dr. Alan Sroufe shares the summary of his (and his team in Minnesota) decades of research looking at attachment though life. They followed individuals from birth through infancy and toddlerhood, to school age, adolescence, early adulthood and now parenthood.  This is important because it helps us understand the essence of what attachment is measuring, and how to cultivate security no matter what age you are or what background you come from. Dr. Sroufe is an internationally recognized expert on early attachment relationships, emotional development, and developmental psychopathology and has published seven books and 140 articles on these and related topics! —- Attachment through the lifespan – learn the science behind the longest study ever conducted on attachment Dr. Alan Sroufe’s new book summarizes decades of attachment research – A Compelling Idea, How We Become the Person’s We Are (2020).  It’s part memoire, part history of attachment science – and it’s great for our audience because it brings the findings of this ground-breaking longitudinal research on how we become ourselves in one succinct place. The Minnesota Longitudinal Study of Risk and Adaptation began in the early 1970s, initiated by Byron Egeland as a study of a large cohort of mothers living in poverty. In the 1970s and early 1980s, empirical attachment research had been primarily pursued by Ainsworth and her students. The research group led by Alan Sroufe and Egeland was important in providing a second pillar to hold up the paradigm from the 1970s to the present. The Strange Situation was conducted with the sample by Sroufe and his graduate students Everett Waters and Brian Vaughn. Early work by the research group documented the role of caregiving in shaping patterns of attachment in the Strange Situation, and also the capacity of infant attachment patterns to predict later social competence and mental health. Sroufe and Egeland created an ‘electric atmosphere’ in their research group, as they provided the first longitudinal evidence of the implications of attachment relationships.1 Students described their ‘imperturbable optimism’, ‘wisdom about human nature’, and ‘compassion’ as important qualities in the creation of the atmosphere, along with the sense of contributing to meaningful and cutting-edge developmental science.2 They were a great stabilizing and integrative presence for the field of attachment research. Though Egeland and Sroufe have now retired, research with the Minnesota Longitudinal Study of Risk and Adaptation has continued. Other episodes you may enjoy:  Ep 117 with Dr. Bruce Perry discussing trauma and resilience  Co-host Sue Marriott LCSW, CGP and Dr. Sroufe discuss his reflections – both personal and professional. It is rare to get to sit at the hearth with such an important contributor to the field but you get just that – we encourage you to get the book, sit back and listen to the podcast and learn from the very source. Dr. Sroufe is Professor Emeritus of Child Psychology in the Institute of Child Development at the University of Minnesota and he has been an Associate Editor of Developmental Psychology and Development and Psychopathology.  His awards include the Distinguished Scientific Contribution Award from the Society for Research in Child Development, the Bowlby Ainsworth Award for Contributions to Attachment Research, the G. Stanley Hall Award for Distinguished Scientific Contribution to Developmental Psychology from Division 7 of the American Psychology Association, an Honorary Doctorate Degree from the University of Leiden, and the Distinguished Teaching Award from the College of Education, University of Minnesota. Conversation includes: Guiding question behind Sroufe’s ongoing 1974 study Why is change difficult? Negative expectations can result in off-putting behavior Chronic early stress and early predictors Positive relationships with teachers reported for those with secure attachment backgrounds The importance of a supportive relationship as a predictor Those with secure history who experience bad times don’t lose their secure history “Earned” secure attachment and its neurological intricacies Importance of being able to turn to someone, giving and receiving support, legacies of attachment Resources: A Compelling Idea, How We Become the Person’s We Are (2020) by Alan Sroufe The Development of the Person The Minnesota Study of Risk and Adaptation from Birth Through Adulthood by Dr. Alan Sroufe et al. Hey neuronerds wanting to know more – here is a great link to a PDF summarizing the study and is well worth the read – Minnesota longitudinal study of risk and adaptation – chapter 4   To reach Dr. Sroufe Dr. Sroufe’s CV Lessons from the Minnesota Longitudinal Study Clinical Application of the Adult Attachment Interview Edited by H. Steele & M. Steele Haven’t gotten enough of attachment through the lifespan?  We have you covered, please hear Sue Marriott’s conversation with him from a few years ago – episode 56 click below. https://therapistuncensored.com/episodes/tu56-how-we-come-to-define-ourselves-attachment-research-over-decades-with-guest-alan-sroufe/ Tweet

15 Helmi 20211h 2min

Learn more about your relationships no matter what, but if you happen to be a therapist,  dig into learning more about couples in therapy. Every couple has its ups and downs, but it’s easy to think that your relationship is uniquely challenging. Experts in couples therapy and a couple themselves, Ellyn Bader and Peter Pearson join co-host Sue Marriott to discuss what most people get wrong about working with couples, and how to help get it right. Together, they’ll dive into the dos and don’ts of couples therapy, from the perspective of the therapist and the patient. Who are Ellyn Bader and Peter Pearson? Dr. Ellyn Bader is considered by many to be the preeminent expert in couples therapy training. Together with her husband, Dr. Peter Pearson, they created the Developmental Model of Couples Therapy, and literally wrote the book on marital therapy.   Peter Pearson, Ph.D., and his wife, Dr. Ellyn Bader, founded The Couples Institute in 1984. Both have now helped literally thousands of couples in their work. Pete and Ellyn have been featured in over 50 radio and television programs including The Today Show, Good Morning America, and CBS Early Morning News. They have appeared on NPR and been quoted in publications including The New York Times, Oprah Magazine, Business Insider, Redbook, and Cosmopolitan. Their popular book, Tell Me No Lies, and In Quest of a Mythical Mate has been of critical help to many couples. What’s the point of couples therapy? The Holy Grail of couples work is really just trying to help couples differentiate together, instead of just individuating on their own. What do we mean by that? Put simply, tensions and difference doesn’t have to be scary and separate, but can instead be exciting. Most fights are, at their core, power struggles. It’s often framed as “I want you to change to accommodate me” and vice versa. To grow and change, they need to shift their focus away from winners and losers, but instead towards the WE. The key to couples getting there, is helping each person really own their own stuff. Importantly, can we take responsibility without shame for our own role in each conflict. What generates change in relationships? There are three things that really get couples to change their behavior Desperation or crisis – whether it’s a medical emergency or a natural disaster, having an external purpose or focus can generate really quick and in depth communication Negotiation – often the most common thing we try and do as couples, “I’ll change X if you change Y” is often the shortest lived and also hardest to make stick Inspiration – is there something compelling enough or exciting enough about the future to inspire a change What role do therapist play? There’s no substitute for having years of experience as a couples therapist. Specifically, if you’re looking for a new couples therapist, make sure to interview them and really find a place and a person that will be right for you. It’s also important to remember that the therapist isn’t there to take anyone’s side. Again, couples therapy is about finding and holding your own accountability. You need to be prepared to do the work on your own side to make your relationship grown and expand. You might also enjoy: https://therapistuncensored.com/episodes/tu121-the-purpose-of-relationships-redefined-during-quarantine-with-stan-tatkin/ https://therapistuncensored.com/episodes/holding-your-own1-messy-but-secure-relating/ RESOURCES: Ellyn and Peter’s website contains all kinds of interactive materials and blogs. A must see! https://www.couplesinstitutetraining.com/ Need CEU’s??  We’ve got you covered, use OURCLAN for 10% off – It’s Not Me It’s My Amygdala – Advanced Course Connecting the Sciences of the Mind to Everyday Relationships FOUR hours of quality content and 3 CE’s available to professionals. Since you are this deep into our show notes, then you are indeed one of our peeps and thus invited to be part of our clan  GET 10% off this signature course by using code OURCLAN!  – To get more of this kind of in-depth discussion with quality content and real-world healing – join us on FB where you can find more of your peeps. Join our Neuronerd Patreon community at http://www.patreon.com/therapistuncensored for as little as $5 per month.   Join us now. Now offering reading/study groups exclusively for our patrons.

1 Helmi 202154min

Dive into hook up culture, locker room talk, and the modern shifts in youth sexual behavior and health. Peggy Orenstein, NYT best-selling author, unpacks her new book “Boys and Sex” with co-host Ann Kelley. In this peak behind the curtain of the experience of young male sexuality, we’ll see how boys struggle with the conflicting needs of the conquest narrative of sex and their own internal understanding of pleasure and vulnerability. Her book was written about both cis and trans men, and covers the whole spectrum of sexual orientations, backgrounds, and experiences. Who is Peggy Orenstein? New York Times Bestselling Author of “Boys and Sex” and “Girls and Sex” Named one of the “40 women who changed the media business in the past 40 years” by The Columbia Journalism Review Her TED Talk, “What Young Women Believe About Their Own Sexual Pleasure,” has been viewed over 4.9 million times Frequent writer and contributor for The New York Times, NPR, Good Morning America, and many other talk shows What’s to learn? Through her research and conversations with young men Orenstein learned two major things That boys are ready and willing to have honest, blunt, and insightful dialogues about their sexuality and the way they understand sex That nobody really asked them about it before, that adults weren’t talking to them about what a full healthy sexuality looks like The recognition of emotional and physical vulnerability in sex allows us to discover something deeply personal about ourselves, and young men and boys are often intentionally cut off from those feelings and experiences. Both through societal norms and expectations as well as pornography. What can we do to help change the culture around sex? Sex discussions should include more than just consent, according to Shafia Zaloom in “Sex, Teens, and Everything in Between.” Sex should be legal, ethical, and good. To help achieve that in the next generation, Orenstein outlines at the end of her book a set of the kinds of conversations you can have with your children to promote connection, compassion, and empathy in their sex lives. Some other recommendations Orenstein has for how to shift “locker room culture” Coaches can bring in programming on sexual health and behavior Friends taking friends aside, away from the large group, and have one on one talks about their behavior Recognize that it will be a challenge but know that it isn’t impossible RESOURCES: Additional resources for this episode: “Boys and Sex: Young Men on Hookups, Love, Porn, Consent, and Navigating the New Masculinity” by Peggy Orenstein “Girls and Sex: Navigating the Complicated New Landscape” by Peggy Orenstein “Sex, Teens, and Everything in Between: The New and Necessary Conversations Today’s Teenagers Need to Have About Consent, Sexual Harassment, Healthy Relationships, Love, and More” by Shafia Zaloom “Masks, No Kissing, and ‘a Little Kinky’: Dating and Sex in a Pandemic” by Tara Parker-Pope “Sex in the Time of Coronavirus” by Elizabeth Bernstein “American Hookup: The New Culture of Sex on Campus” by Lisa Wade Need CEU’s??  We’ve got you covered, use OURCLAN for 10% off – It’s Not Me It’s My Amygdala – Advanced Course Connecting the Sciences of the Mind to Everyday Relationships FOUR hours of quality content and 3 CE’s available to professionals. Since you are this deep into our show notes, then you are indeed one of our peeps and thus invited to be part of our clan  GET 10% off this signature course by using code OURCLAN!  – To get more of this kind of in-depth discussion with quality content and real-world healing – join us on FB where you can find more of your peeps.  Want even more than that?  Join our Neuronerd Patreon community at patreon.com/therapistuncensored for as little as $5 per month.   Join us now.

13 Joulu 202058min

Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities – take away’s from our series on staying (or becoming) secure in relationship with those with challenging personalities – DEDICATED TO OUR PATRONS!! Session 6 of 6 – What if it’s you that is the challenging one… and other take away’s on challenging personalities.  Let us help you change your internal security and grow secure functioning relationships.  This episode is dedicated our to our private community of Patron Neuronerds. Here is a smattering of some of our most special elves whom have been with us since the very beginning!!   They give from $1 to $25 per month and jumped in at the first chance to support us AND have stuck with us!!! THANK YOU TO Kathleen Geiger, Isaac Marsolek, Jacalyn Brecher, James Baker,Carys Adultman, Claire Holberton, Camille Scent, Kirill Eremenko, Sonya Richardson-Thomas, Ashley Cruz, Michael Hilgers, Becki Mendivil, Linno Rhodes, Lorie Ammon, Deb, Donna Woods, Pat Spencer, Jeffrey Benzick MD, Judy Kamara, Leanna, Bobbi Blain, Megan Smith, Tyra Butler, Amy Groessl, Theresa Tenney, Kathryn Antenbring, Sarah Lazarewicz, Julie Carbaugh, Sally Mounir, Anonymous … and so many many more who joined forces since that first moment.  You guys are our backbone. You can find more of our current Patrons here (we have almost 200)!  We thank Platinum and Gold Neuronerds on our website.   We don’t usually include our actual transcript but what the heck, we are gonna try it this time and see if it’s useful to anybody.   Unedited transcript of the show Episode notes – HYO Challenging Personalities: What if it’s you that is the difficult one?  How to change – Insecurity begets defensiveness – so anything we can do to lower our defenses, realize we most likely aren’t ACTUALLY under attack, and work towards safety inside ourselves and cultivating safety in our close others. Much of the episode is devoted to this topic, these show notes will focus on resources in general.  We mention being raised by difficult parents but that’s a big topic for another time so we put in some resources for ya down below. For EVERYBODY – we can all improve our listening skills: Listen and repeat it back so they other person says “yea, that’s right”  The trick here is not to assert your own agenda.  It’s not your turn, just listen. Ask questions to help them get their story out in full, or to get their pain out there so you can bear witness DON’T CORRECT or explain yourself yet. Validate where you can do so authentically – try to find even 1% of what they are saying where you can join the person talking.  It does NOT mean you agree with them.  This is ninja warrior stuff, it’s not easy and rookies get this WRONG. Comfort, soothe them.  Not just once.  Not angrily, TAKE THEM IN, bear witness and let them feel you with them.  Do this UNTIL you feel them release and soften.  Again, rookies stop short and then don’t get it when the listening doesn’t help. CAVA — Clarify, ask question, validate where you feel it true and if appropriate, apologize LUV –  Listen, Understand and Validate where you can authentically For EVERYONE – we bet we can all also improve our self-regulation skills RAIN Tara Brach Review, Reflect, Rewire Self compassion and Kristen Neff – see previous episode here. Ann and Sue give several personal examples of what this looks like and support you in knowing your own truth, claiming it and living your best life possible. Research/links on challenging traits  Voicing the Victims of Narcissistic Partners: A Qualitative Analysis of Responses to Narcissistic Injury and Self-Esteem Regulation Volume: 9 issue: 2, Article first published online: April 28, 2019; Issue published: April 1, 2019 Ava Valashjardi1, Kathy Charles1 1Edinburgh Napier University, UK This article is distributed under the terms of the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License (http://www.creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/) which permits any use, reproduction and distribution of the work without further permission provided the original work is attributed as specified on the SAGE and Open Access pages (https://us.sagepub.com/en-us/nam/open-access-at-sage). Empathy and self-boundaries Judith Jordan PhD  PDF “Can narcissists be moved to show empathy?” 2014  Journal of Personality and Social Psychology Hatfield, E., Bensman, L., Thornton, P. D., & Rapson, R. (2014). New perspectives on emotional contagion: A review of classic and recent research on facial mimicry and contagion. Interpersonal: An International Journal of Personal Relations, 8, 159-179. Resources – We packed these shownotes today with resources just for you!! Covert narcissism scale  Don’t believe online tests in general, but for fun you can see how you score on covert narcisissm. Psychcentral has personality quizzes – some are validated scales adapted for the internet some are more for fun, but none provide actual diagnosis for sure.  However, you may be interested in exploring these, if so enjoy! Get Me Out of Here by Rachel Reiland  This is an excellent book although it’s older, a first-hand account of the healing trajectory written by woman who identifies as borderline.  Fascinating and hopeful… recommended read esp for those doing deep work in therapy The Borderline Personality Disorder Workbook – self-help workbook by Daniel J Fox PhD Loving Someone with Borderline Personality Disorder: How to Keep Out-of-Control Emotions from Destroying Your Relationship Shari Y Manning PhD Borderline Personality Disorder: The hidden faces of BPD that you need to spot. How to manage out of control emotions before they destroy your relationship “How to make the narcissist in your life a little nicer” The Atlantic “How to manage a narcissist” Harvard Business Review – Focuses on workplace highly applicable to all The Wizard of Oz and Other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family Being Raised by Difficult Parents: Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents Linday Gibson PhD Will I Ever Be Good Enough?: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers  Karle McBride PhD Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents “How being raised by a narcissist damages your life and self-esteem ” Forbes Magazine,  Kathy Caprino Resources from malignant narcisissism episode: Friends – we know most of you aren’t in this situation but if you are we want to be a resource.  We can’t say if you should or shouldn’t leave – that’s a highly personal and seriously safety-dependent question.  However we can say that we believe you, you aren’t alone, and there is support once you get ready for that. United States:  Click the image to the left for help! Not in the US, no problem:  International lines for domestic violence help click here  Many areas have local resources so look for those as well. Psychopath Free (Expanded Edition): Recovering from Emotionally Abusive Relationships With Narcissists, Sociopaths, and Other Toxic People Jackson Macenzi Grindell et al Gaslighting: Recognize the Narcissist, Learn How to Spot Emotional Abuse, Protect Yourself and Heal From Malignant Narcissism (NPD) Aubrey Scrivelor Becoming the Narcissist’s Nightmare: How to Devalue and Discard the Narcissist While Supplying Yourself Shahida  Abrabi Traumatic Narcissism Daniel Shaw “Don’t You Know Who I Am?”: How to Stay Sane in an Era of Narcissism, Entitlement, and Incivility Ramani Durvasula POWER: Surviving and Thriving After Narcissistic Abuse: A Collection of Essays on Malignant Narcissism and Recovery from Emotional Abuse Shahida Arabi  Healing from Hidden Abuse: A Journey Through the Stages of Recovery from Psychological Abuse Shannon Thomas LCSW Attachment Disturbances in Adults Comprehensive Treatment & Repair(2016) Dan Brown and David Elliott (This is Sue’s favorite textbook on attachment currently) OK friends if you have found the bottom of these show notes then you are our people.  Find us on Facebook @austinshrinks and from there, join our free private discussion community. If that is not enough, consider purchasing our signature (4 hour!!) course and use “ourclan” to get a discount on enrollment.  It’s Not Me It’s My Amygdala Advanced Course Connecting the Science of the Mind to the Amygdala  Finally, we invite you to join our patron Neuronerd community for some occasional bling and behind the scenes stuff, as well as helping to keep us Ad-Free!!! We are at almost 200 active and engaged patrons – help us get over the hump to 200, will ya? Without this super smart and active community we could not produce the way we do, could not get the science out to the world who would otherwise not even know it’s out there and most importantly to some — we would have to be running ads. (shriek!)  I am so bugged by the aggressive advertising on You Tube and many podcasts… we understand you gotta do it to sustain production but if we can sustain another way, then we are all for it!   We have a few straggler platforms where you may run into an ad, but once we get our patron community more robust we will be able to eliminate them all. Thanks for stopping by – we really appreciate you and hope this show provides even a tiny inspiration. xo

10 Joulu 20201h 5min

Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities – staying (or becoming) secure in relationship with those with the most severe sort of personality structure – malignant narcissism. Session 5 – Staying safe with those with high psychopathology or malignant narcissism Accusations are their confessions. In this episode learn why we elect, promote, excuse and love those with malignant narcissism and its tendencies. Sort out the other forms of self-involvement, psychopathology and anti-social traits from this dangerous personality structure. Sue & Ann finish out their series on Holding Your Own with Challenging Personality Traits – this is session 5 of 6. Find more here www.therapistuncensored.com Five Points from Malignant Narcissism: We all have elements of self-centeredness and narcissistic traits. However, when it becomes more engrained into our personality structure, that is where the problems can arise. Narcissism, at its core, involves a sense of entitlement, exploitation and extreme self-focus that loses touch with one’s ability to see the needs of others. Grandiose and covert narcissist can become so self-involved that they can completely dismiss others in extremely painful ways as discussed in our previous episodes. However, they generally continue to hold relationships in value. Their primary difficulty lies in the tendency to idealize and devalue, which often leads to feeling misunderstood and mistreated. Thus, they can lack guilt because they often see themselves as right or the victim to injustice. However, when they do discover that they have wronged someone, they can feel significant guilt and shame. In malignant Narcissism, there is a general void of guilt and shame. Instead, there is a combination of antisocial traits, paranoia and vindictiveness that often leads to acting out in intentionally harmful ways. In Malignant narcissism the value placed on others is primarily based on utility – what others can do for them. The relational aspect is void. They do not have access to guilt of felt shame. This has been cut off. Malignant narcissist expects extremely loyalty at all costs. Loyalty to them, not to ideals.  If you are with me you are with me! If not, you are against me. This type of thinking leaves open rational for retaliation and extreme  vendictivness.  One way to know if our relationship, family, company or country is being run by a malignant narcissistic ruler, is to recognize that those under them are in a constant state of fear and threat of the disloyal “other”.   In many countries across the world, including the US, we have found ourselves and our nervous system in a constant state of threat and fear. This divides us. The “other” is a source to mistrusted to be fought against.  One sign of a malignant narcissist is the cool and coldness with which they can seek revenge in a calculating manner. If you are in a relationship and you see signs that he/she justifies revenge for mistreatment, that is something to take not of, especially if this revenge is sought with a sense of pleasure at the suffering of the other. If in a relationship with someone that has malignant narcissism, there is little hope of change. The focus must be for you to protect yourself, seek support and safely get out of the relationship. They may use their sense of loyalty and disloyalty as a weapon to keep you in. Remember, loyalty should never involve fear of retribution.  As we finish out this series, we know you  now have a good understanding of some of the challenging styles to engage in relationship and we’ve saved the toughest for last.  In this episode we sort out the difference between self-centeredness, narcissism, anti-social personality and malignant narcissism. This series builds on itself so we recommend that you listen to the previous sessions first before jumping into this episode, but if that isn’t your cup of tea, then by all means, the episode will be solid on it’s own.  To start at the beginning & hear the previous episodes in the series click here: Session 1 (Messy but secure), Session 2 (grandiose narcissism), Session 3 (covert narcissism) or Session 4 (borderline traits)  Power dynamics in this form of narcissism  Difference between anti-social characteristics, psychopathy and malignant narcissism. Differentials between the types of narcissism – keys regarding how to discriminate between covert grandiose and malignant. Hallmarks – vindictiveness malice & cruelty Warning to therapists – empathy can be a sign of weakness not connection Intense initial courting may be a foreshadowing of control. What does shame and guilt have to do with how challenging personality traits show up? Projected relationality as the bridge to staying trapped Knowing your truth The biology of threat and induction to passively follow a “strong” leader  Resources – Hey friends – we know most of you aren’t in this situation but if you are we want to be a resource.  We can’t say if you should or shouldn’t leave – that’s a highly personal and seriously safety-dependent question.  However we can say that we believe you, you aren’t alone, and there is support once you get ready for that. United States:  Click the image to the left for help! Not in the US, no problem:  International lines for domestic violence help click here  Many areas have local resources so look for those as well. Psychopath Free (Expanded Edition): Recovering from Emotionally Abusive Relationships With Narcissists, Sociopaths, and Other Toxic People Jackson Macenzi Grindell et al Gaslighting: Recognize the Narcissist, Learn How to Spot Emotional Abuse, Protect Yourself and Heal From Malignant Narcissism (NPD) Aubrey Scrivelor Becoming the Narcissist’s Nightmare: How to Devalue and Discard the Narcissist While Supplying Yourself Shahida  Abrabi Traumatic Narcissism Daniel Shaw “Don’t You Know Who I Am?”: How to Stay Sane in an Era of Narcissism, Entitlement, and Incivility Ramani Durvasula POWER: Surviving and Thriving After Narcissistic Abuse: A Collection of Essays on Malignant Narcissism and Recovery from Emotional Abuse Shahida Arabi  Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents Linday Gibson PhD The Wizard of Oz and Other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family Will I Ever Be Good Enough?: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers  Karle McBride PhD Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents Healing from Hidden Abuse: A Journey Through the Stages of Recovery from Psychological Abuse Shannon Thomas LCSW Attachment Disturbances in Adults Comprehensive Treatment & Repair(2016) Dan Brown and David Elliott (This is Sue’s favorite textbook on attachment currently) OK friends if you have found the bottom of these show notes then you are our people.  Find us on Facebook @austinshrinks and from there, join for free our discussion community. If that is not enough, consider purchasing our signature (4 hour!!) course and use “ourclan” to get a discount on enrollment.  It’s Not Me It’s My Amygdala Advanced Course Connecting the Science of the Mind to the Amygdala  Finally, we invite you to join our patron Neuronerd community for some occasional bling and behind the scenes stuff, as well as helping to keep us Ad-Free!!! Thanks for stopping by – we really appreciate you and hope this show provides even a tiny inspiration. xo

30 Marras 202039min

Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities – staying (or becoming) secure in relationship with those with those with “borderline” traits Session 4 – Staying secure in connection with borderline or highly reactive responses When does sensitivity cross the line into clinical reactivity? Borderline traits, or those with highly reactive personalities, are another common challenge in relationship that we might need support to navigate well. Today’s episode sees co-hosts Ann Kelley and Sue Marriott unpack high reactivity through a caring and developmental approach. Together, they discuss how these dynamics and traits arise, what they look like, and what we can do when we find ourselves in relationships with them. Find more here www.therapistuncensored.com/episodes Co-hosts Ann Kelley and Sue Marriott have launched a new series titled “Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities.” Together, they’ll sort out the differences between the various forms of narcissism – grandiose, covert and malignant, as well as look at what has been called borderline traits. The goal of this series is to bring you the skills and practices that help you ground and stay in your secure self no matter what is swirling around you. This series builds on itself so we recommend that you listen to the previous sessions first before jumping into this episode, but if that isn’t your cup of tea, then by all means, the episode will be solid on it’s own.  To start at the beginning & hear the previous episodes in the series click here: Session 1, Session 2, and Session 3. High Reactivity (or borderline traits) Neurological implications Especially women historically have been harmed by this label. It takes the treating professional off the hook and blames the patient. However now we know a lot more of what to do how to treat it. Better technology. It’s not moral.  To be clear, these people aren’t just being dramatic or “overreacting.” In their felt experience there really is a crisis happening. Most commonly, this happens when someone is overly trusting or attached, and then perceives a loss or abandonment due to mismatched perspectives. Without doing normal tracking of the situation they can perceive a change or even as happening all at once in a big way. In this way, individuals with high reactivity experience two different types of self that flip back and forth quickly, an idealized experience and a de-valued experience. This can often express itself through deep and dramatic mood swings. Sometimes even this can result in self-harm, or threats of self-harm. So what can you do about borderline or high reactive personalities? As with all things, stay focused and centered. It won’t help anyone if you blow up in response to someone else’s panicked reaction. In fact it will only escalate the situation and cause everyone to go into a highly defense state. That being said, attune to yourself, ask yourself what this experience is evoking in you? Recognize that their reaction is hard on you, and then recognize them. Don’t lose yourself in trying to appease them or hold them. Try and return to honest communicate. Attune to each other and take everyone’s pain or fear seriously. Remember, this is not just a silly or “ridiculous” overreaction but instead a real felt experience that they are having. You’re not going to let someone abuse you or disrespect you, there’s definitely a limit that you’re going to have. But at the same time, it’s important to have a bit of thick skin and comfort and care for the other person. Remind both yourself and them that this experience you’re having together right then isn’t all that there is to a person, or a relationship. Nobody fits in a box! In this series we set the stage and call out pathological use of labels and diagnosis.  We begin with secure but messy relating and then wade into the various traits that can become personality based on degree. Resources “Get Me Out of Here” by Rachel Reiland  This is an excellent book although it’s older, a first-hand account of the healing trajectory written by woman who identifies as borderline.  Fascinating and hopeful… recommended read. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/toxic-relationships/201909/the-drama-loving-borderline Skills Training Manual for BPD Marsha Linehan Affect Regulation…. Peter Fonagy et al Traumatic Narcissism the Relational Systems of Subjugation by David Grey Attachment Disturbances in Adults Comprehensive Treatment & Repair(2016) Dan Brown and David Elliott (This is Sue’s favorite textbook on attachment currently) This is not our first rodeo, see these previous episodes on the subject: TU105: Narcissism – What’s Going on Underneath the Defense?  TU107: Our Powerful Fascination with Narcissism in the Era of Trump OK friends if you have found the bottom of these shownotes then you are people.  Find us on Facebook @austinshrinks and from there, join for free our discussion community. If that is not enough, consider purchasing our signature (4 hour!!) course and use “ourclan” to get a discount on enrollment.  It’s Not Me It’s My Amygdala  Finally, we invite you to join our patron Neuronerd community for some bling and behind the scenes stuff, as well as helping to keep us Ad-Free!!!

18 Marras 202043min

Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities – staying (or becoming) secure in relationship with those with covert narcissism. Session 3 – Staying secure in connection with one kind of narcissism:  covert narcissism When does self-consciousness and self-reflection cross the line into self-preoccupation? Covert narcissism is also called thin-skinned, vulnerable, depressed or closet narcissism. It’s a real thing but unlike grandiosity, it’s quite hard to spot!  Think about it – if you feel when you walk in a room everyone is looking at you – admiringly or judgmentally, either way – that is a narcissistic fantasy. Today’s episode follows the other side of grandiosity. Find more here www.therapistuncensored.com/episodes Co-hosts Ann Kelley and Sue Marriott have launched a new series titled “Holding Your Own with Challenging Personalities.” Together, they’ll sort out the differences between the various forms of narcissism – grandiose, covert and malignant, as well as look at what has been called borderline traits. The goal of this series is to bring you the skills and practices that help you ground and stay in your secure self no matter what is swirling around you. This series builds on itself so we recommend that you listen to Sessions 1 and 2 first before jumping into this episode, but if that isn’t your cup of tea, then by all means, the episode will be solid on it’s own.  To start at the beginning & hear the previous episodes in the series click here: TU132 HYO Session 1 Messy but Secure Relating  and TU133 HYO Session 2 Grandiose Narcissism. Covert Narcissism It has so many different names:  vulnerable, thin-skinned, depressed narcissism… it’s a real thing but unlike grandiosity, it’s quite hard to spot!  That’s why they call it “covert.” Sometimes, somebody in the corner that looks like they’re avoiding and shunning attention can make us focus our attention on them. There is an ability to be very loud while staying very quite. What’s the difference? Why are they both called Narcissism? Covert narcissism is something many of us can relate to – super self-conscious about imagining everyone judging us – negatively.  Yet it’s still special, just negatively special.  We all do that at times but it’s a matter of degree – how self-centered and self-focused are we? All narcissism is about our relationships with shame. For grandiose narcissism, shame is projected out into other people. But in covert narcissism, shame is being pulled in from all around us as another form of being exceptional. Because of the way covert narcissism uses shame, it is also sometimes called depressed narcissism. So what’s the difference between depression and covert narcissism? Depression is often an utter depletion, a flatness in your body where you feel empty, but still have a sense of self. Simply put, it’s you that’s bad. Cover narcissism on the other hand pushes those feelings outward, and often losses the sense of self. It’s more of a feeling of bitterness and like something was done to you. Simply that it’s the world that’s bad to you. Often, this is associated with achievement. A covert narcissist might thinks they must be the most attractive in the room, and if they aren’t that, then they are at the bottom of the pile.  They’ve tied their sense of self and their self-esteem to the approval of others. This really comes from how we’re valued through our development. If we’re valued because of what we can bring to someone else, it’s really hard to feel the development of a true sense of identity. Instead, a covert narcissism unconsciously needs to bring the negative attention towards themselves to create rescue ie attention, thus providing a sense of worthiness.  Sounds odd we know, but it’s true.  They are highly sensitive to rejection and overly personalize – there you can see the narcissism, it’s all about them and their injury. How can you tell you’re dealing with a covert narcissist? If you’re being used to maintain someone else’s self-esteem that signal of narcissism in general.  If not getting filled by that extension, there is a desperate sense of emptiness right below the surface. Importantly, a covert narcissist can often come across as the victim which can initially bring out a lot of sympathy. Really ask yourself, how many people are in this relationship?  Are you orbiting the other, walking on egg shells?   In a relationship with a covert narcissist you can really lose your own sense of self and own identity. You can become afraid of celebrating your success, or feel the need to downplay an achievement of yours in order to not upset your partner. If you start to hold yourself the other person may feel threatened at the differentiation. What can you do in the face of covert narcissism? Most importantly, we should help people with covert narcissism find their sense of agency. This includes an imperfection. Instead of identifying the external situation that was done to someone, we can turn towards identifying their own role in a situation. Challenge the internal narrative that they are the victim of some external harm.  The idea is to build up their own sense of self and creates a more complete identity not tied to other relationships or people. In fact, if we join with their experience too much, and are overly agreeable, that can often aid the feeling of victimization. When you move to hold the other person at the expense of you, usually trying to protect their feelings, it doesn’t help move out of the narcissistic dynamic. Also, you can start to hold your own. Take a breath, maybe one or two or ten, and settle down to avoid just getting into a fight. Don’t just push off and leave them high and dry with their envy or pain, but also make sure you’re not going to collapse completely and protect their feelings. The big take away from all of this is helping people move into a stable in-between space. You aren’t the greatest best person ever, but you also certainty not the worst. We’re all human, with our own identities and imperfections and that’s all okay! Why a podcast series? Our normal episodes serve as great snack packs of information about a wide range of topics, but don’t often let us go into as much depth as maybe we could. We had originally planned to create a course on narcissism and healthy relationships that would really allow us to dig deep and unpack this all at a level that a regular podcast just wasn’t able to do. But given the nature of the content and the times we’re living in we decided to bring you all that course FOR FREE in the form of this new mini-series that we’re doing here at Therapist Uncensored! We’re still working out all the kinks on this new format for all of you so feel free as always to hit us up with any feedback on how this new format is working! Our plan is to release episodes much more frequently through the series and then go back to our every other week format. Nobody fits in a box! In this series we set the stage and call out pathological use of labels and diagnosis.  We begin with secure but messy relating and then wade into the various traits that can become personality based on degree. Resources This is not our first rodeo, see these previous episodes on the subject: To start at the beginning, listen to the previous episodes in the series: TU132 HYO Session 1 Messy but Secure Relating  and TU133 HYO Session 2 Grandiose Narcissism. The Covert Passive Aggressive Narcissist: Recognizing the Traits and Finding Healing After Hidden Emotional and Psychological Abuse Debbie Merza TU 111 Navigating Narcissitic Relationships Manipulation Gas-Lighting and Grandiosity Called Out  TU107: Narcissism – What’s Going on Underneath the Defense?  TU107: Our Powerful Fascination with Narcissism in the Era of Trump TU 23 Building Grit through Self-Compassion with Kristin Neff Attachment Disturbances in Adults Comprehensive Treatment & Repair (2016) Dan Brown and David Elliott (This is Sue’s favorite textbook on attachment currently) Traumatic Narcissism the Relational Systems of Subjugation by David Grey

10 Marras 202035min