345: Co-Fermenting Cider & Beer | Four Phantoms Brewery, MA
Cider Chat23 Marras 2022

345: Co-Fermenting Cider & Beer | Four Phantoms Brewery, MA

Four Phantoms Looks to Historical Co-Ferments

Head Brewer and owner Drew Phillips of Four Phantoms Brewery in Greenfield Massachusetts spoke on Folks Traditions and the Co-Fermentation of Wort and Apple Juice and the brewery's co-ferment called Old Gods (8.0%). There were two talks on the subject, with the first being November 3rd and the second on November 6th as part of CiderDays 2.0 compilation of events. This episode is from the November 6th presentation.

Drew is no stranger to fermenting having spent time brewing first in Oregon and then as Head Cidermaker at Artifact Cider Project in Florence, Massachusetts before opening Four Phantoms over two years ago.

His interest in old brewing traditions and recipes has him pushing the envelope with special ferments and Old Gods is a great representation of what can be done, when done well. (Read: Old Gods is delicious!!)

Folk Traditions Around Co-fermenting Cider and Beer

Drew notes that historically there wasn't such a delineation between beer, cider and mead as there is now. He notes how that in Wassail songs , the call for mixing cider, beer and elderberry boughs all into the same beverage. The use of Hydrometers or the science of acid titration are recent adaptations to a farmhouse fermenter's tool box.

Up until the 19th century fermenters would brew by taste and if the wort didn't taste good you would grind up more grain and mash it in, which is a classic way of brewing a farmhouse ale. - Brew by Taste.

Drew notes the difference between wort (the base of beer) and apple juice the base for cider. For yeast health fermenters are looking for YAN (Yeast Assimiable Nutrients). In apple juice there isn't alot of YAN whereas with Wort there is alot. Thus Farmers would ferment Farmhouse ales and often blended in fresh pressed apple juice.

No Heat Ferment

Other than the sparing that taste place with the grain used for beer, there is no boiling of the wort as is typical with brewing. Thus, a farmhouse ale can be easily blended in with apple juice to create this co-ferment concoction.

The Making of Old Gods at Four Phantoms

  • 100 gallons of unpasteurized Mcintoush apple juice.
  • No yeast inoculation
  • Blend in with Raw ale - typical farmhouse style
    • The wort was not boiled -
    • No hops
    • Mashed into a whole mash tun of birch branches

The result is a tasting drink that blends the two products together. Make sure to try Old Gods at Four Phantoms each fall.

Contact info for Four Phantoms Brewery

Mentions in this Chat

Help Support Cider Chat Please donate today. Help keep the chat thriving!

Find this episode and all episodes at the page for Cider Chat's podcasts.

Tämä jakso on lisätty Podme-palveluun avoimen RSS-syötteen kautta eikä se ole Podmen omaa tuotantoa. Siksi jakso saattaa sisältää mainontaa.

Jaksot(520)

517: What Made ACE Cider Brand Worth $40+ Million

517: What Made ACE Cider Brand Worth $40+ Million

Jeffrey House and his wife Angela founded the California Cider Company in 1993 and built ACE Cider into a nationally distributed brand before selling the company in 2021. In this Cider Chat, Jeffrey g...

14 Loka 1h 5min

516: Tasting Time | Totally Cider Tour '26 - France

516: Tasting Time | Totally Cider Tour '26 - France

What does time taste like? Join Cider Chat MC Ria on the 2026 Totally Cider Tour through Normandy, Domfrontais and Brittany, where cider, poiré, Pommeau and Calvados become a way of experiencing place...

7 Loka 56min

515: World of Cider: The Baltic Region

515: World of Cider: The Baltic Region

What happens when a cider region has the apples, but not centuries of rules telling cidermakers what cider is supposed to be? Recorded at CiderCon 2026 in Providence, Rhode Island, this World of Cider...

23 Syys 51min

514: Doing More With Lees | Ryan Monkman

514: Doing More With Lees | Ryan Monkman

Lees are more than sediment at the bottom of a tank. Recorded at CiderCon 2026 in Providence, Rhode Island, cidermaker and fermentation consultant Ryan Monkman explores how cidermakers can put lees to...

9 Syys 53min

513: Still Cider, Single Apples and Time | Sowams, Rhode Island

513: Still Cider, Single Apples and Time | Sowams, Rhode Island

What happens when a cidermaker decides to do less and give cider more time? Spencer Morris of Sowams Cider Works in Warren, Rhode Island, makes cider with more than 70 apple varieties, old mechanical ...

26 Elo 1h 6min

512: Plant the Damn Apple Tree | Special Edition

512: Plant the Damn Apple Tree | Special Edition

Cider Chat MC Ria Windcaller reads her August eCiderNews editorial, Plant the Damn Apple Tree, reflecting on entrepreneurship, uncertainty, abundance, and what an apple tree might teach us about the t...

24 Elo 10min

511: Hungarian Cider Comes of Age | Bright Cider

511: Hungarian Cider Comes of Age | Bright Cider

Hungary may not have a centuries-old cider tradition like England or France, but that is exactly what makes its modern cider movement so exciting. In this episode, Cider MC Ria Windcaller travels to B...

12 Elo 54min

510: From Barrels to the Pub | The People's Cider Co., Michigan

510: From Barrels to the Pub | The People's Cider Co., Michigan

Most cider makers dream of expanding their barrel program. Jason Lummen did the opposite. In Episode 510, Ria Windcaller visits The People's Cider Company in Grand Rapids, Michigan, where Jason explai...

29 Heinä 59min

Suosittua kategoriassa Yhteiskunta

olipa-kerran-otsikko
sita
seitseman
siita-on-vaikea-puhua
i-dont-like-mondays
hupiklubi
uutiscast
poks
download
antin-palautepalvelu
mamma-mia
yopuolen-tarinoita-2
kaksi-aitia
kolme-kaannekohtaa
rss-murhan-anatomia
aikalisa
rss-palmujen-varjoissa
gogin-ja-janin-maailmanhistoria
vallattomat
kummitusjuttuja