Let Them Eat Meat: There is Nothing Wrong With Rearing and Killing Animals for Human Consumption

Let Them Eat Meat: There is Nothing Wrong With Rearing and Killing Animals for Human Consumption

This event took place on the 31st of October at the Royal Institution in London. CHAIR: Afua Hirsch - Writer and broadcaster SPEAKERS FOR THE MOTION: AA Gill - The Sunday Times’s star restaurant and TV critic AGAINST THE MOTION: George Monbiot - Guardian columnist, environmental campaigner and author of Regenesis: Feeding the World without Devouring the Planet Fancy a nice juicy steak? Most of us do from time to time, and we don’t trouble our consciences too much with the rights and wrongs of eating meat. Others, while vaguely aware that we ought to go vegan, just can’t face the rest of our lives denying ourselves bacon, beef, butter etc. But once we start looking into the arguments for veganism, it becomes difficult to justify the omnivore diet. Take the environment for starters. Livestock farming has a massive impact on the planet, producing around 14% of carbon dioxide equivalent emissions according to the UN. That’s roughly the same as the total amount of global transport emissions. Animals are extremely inefficient processors of the maize and soya that farmers grow to feed them. If we ate those crops ourselves instead of feeding them to livestock, we could free up hundreds of millions of hectares of rainforests, savannahs and wetlands where wild animals could flourish instead. And then there are the arguments about animal welfare. Recent scientific research indicates what many of us feel we already know – that animals have complex emotional lives not dissimilar to our own. Intensive farming – the kind that confines hens, pigs and cattle to squalid indoor pens – thwarts their instincts to move around freely and build social bonds with their group. Tens of billions of animals exist in this way, and that’s before their short lives are ended in the horror house of the abattoir. As for those who say a vegan diet isn’t healthy, elite athletes who have made the switch, including world tennis No 1 Novak Djokovic, prove you don’t need animal protein to excel at the highest levels in sport. On the other side of the argument we developed as omnivores and every human culture has its culinary traditions, based on the taste and aesthetics of meat and dairy. Do we really want to live in a world where there is no beef Wellington or cheese soufflé? As for the environmentalist arguments, omnivores now have some serious eco-credentials behind them. A study at Cornell University shows that a diet that includes a few small portions of grass-fed meat a week may actually be greener than eating no animal products at all. And when it comes to animal welfare, rather than abandoning animal products altogether, couldn’t we do more good by pressing for genuinely transparent labelling of our meat and dairy? If consumers really know what they are getting, fewer people might be willing to buy the £3 chicken produced in the barbaric conditions of the agricultural industry. As for a vegan diet being healthier, we should stop giving airtime to self-appointed health experts and lifestyle bloggers. Some dieticians argue that there are nutrients we need that we just can’t get from plants alone. Yes, we can get calcium from kale and iron from beans, but the quantity, quality and bio-availability of such elements are far better when we get them from animal rather than plant sources. — We’d love to hear your feedback and what you think we should talk about next, who we should have on and what our future debates should be. Send us an email or voice note with your thoughts to podcasts@intelligencesquared.com or Tweet us @intelligence2. And if you’d like to support our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations, as well as ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content, early access and much more, become a supporter of Intelligence Squared today. Just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Episoder(1473)

David Baddiel on Family, Jewishness, and the Healing Power of Comedy, Part Two

David Baddiel on Family, Jewishness, and the Healing Power of Comedy, Part Two

David Baddiel has been on our screens for over 35 years. The creator of The Mary Whitehouse Experience and one half of Baddiel and Skinner Unplanned, he spent his early career in the world of television comedy. More recently, he has become a leading voice on Jewishness and antisemitism in the U.K after releasing his award-winning documentary and book Jews Don’t Count. In October 2024 he came to the Intelligence Squared stage to discuss how both comedy and Jewishness have shaped his career and life. Drawing from his hilarious new memoir My Family, he discussed his upbringing from reckoning with his family’s trauma from the Holocaust to his late mother’s affair with a golfing salesman and his father’s struggles with dementia. Baddiel revealed his family story to shed light on why he believes laughter has the capacity to transform our darkest experiences into something more bearable. This is the second instalment of a two-part episode. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to all our full conversations ad free, plus all of our Members-only content, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events  ...  Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series … Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. … Subscribe to our newsletter here to hear about our latest events, discounts and much more. https://www.intelligencesquared.com/newsletter-signup/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

2 Des 202441min

David Baddiel on Family, Jewishness, and the Healing Power of Comedy, Part One

David Baddiel on Family, Jewishness, and the Healing Power of Comedy, Part One

David Baddiel has been on our screens for over 35 years. The creator of The Mary Whitehouse Experience and one half of Baddiel and Skinner Unplanned, he spent his early career in the world of television comedy. More recently, he has become a leading voice on Jewishness and antisemitism in the U.K after releasing his award-winning documentary and book Jews Don’t Count. In October 2024 he came to the Intelligence Squared stage to discuss how both comedy and Jewishness have shaped his career and life. Drawing from his hilarious new memoir My Family, he discussed his upbringing from reckoning with his family’s trauma from the Holocaust to his late mother’s affair with a golfing salesman and his father’s struggles with dementia. Baddiel revealed his family story to shed light on why he believes laughter has the capacity to transform our darkest experiences into something more bearable. This is the first instalment of a two-part episode. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to all our full conversations ad free, plus all of our Members-only content, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events  ...  Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series … Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. … Subscribe to our newsletter here to hear about our latest events, discounts and much more. https://www.intelligencesquared.com/newsletter-signup/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

1 Des 202436min

The World in 2025 with Peter Frankopan and Emily Maitlis: Making Sense of our Past, Present and Future (Part Two)

The World in 2025 with Peter Frankopan and Emily Maitlis: Making Sense of our Past, Present and Future (Part Two)

We’re living in a time of upheaval. The war in the Middle East is intensifying. Russia is making gains in Ukraine. America faces an election of unparalleled importance. Climate change and AI appear on the brink of changing our world forever. How are we to make sense of the world today? Study its past, argues acclaimed historian Peter Frankopan, who returned to the Intelligence Squared stage in November 2024.  Now that his remarkably turbulent year is almost over, attention is turning to 2025 and what lies in the months ahead for us all. Drawing on his best-selling books, The Silk Roads and The Earth Transformed, Frankopan put our current challenges and opportunities into historical perspective and sought to map out what we can expect from the world in 2025. Frankopan was in conversation with Emily Maitlis, the award-winning journalist and presenter of The News Agents podcast. This is the second instalment of a two-part episode. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to all our full ad free conversations, plus all of our Members-only content, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events  ...  Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series … Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. … Subscribe to our newsletter here to hear about our latest events, discounts and much more. https://www.intelligencesquared.com/newsletter-signup/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

29 Nov 202427min

The World in 2025 with Peter Frankopan and Emily Maitlis: Making Sense of our Past, Present and Future (Part One)

The World in 2025 with Peter Frankopan and Emily Maitlis: Making Sense of our Past, Present and Future (Part One)

We’re living in a time of upheaval. The war in the Middle East is intensifying. Russia is making gains in Ukraine. America faces an election of unparalleled importance. Climate change and AI appear on the brink of changing our world forever. How are we to make sense of the world today? Study its past, argues acclaimed historian Peter Frankopan, who returned to the Intelligence Squared stage in November 2024.  Now that his remarkably turbulent year is almost over, attention is turning to 2025 and what lies in the months ahead for us all. Drawing on his best-selling books, The Silk Roads and The Earth Transformed, Frankopan put our current challenges and opportunities into historical perspective and sought to map out what we can expect from the world in 2025. Frankopan was in conversation with Emily Maitlis, the award-winning journalist and presenter of The News Agents podcast. This is the first instalment of a two-part episode. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to all our full ad free conversations, plus all of our Members-only content, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events  ...  Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series … Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. … Subscribe to our newsletter here to hear about our latest events, discounts and much more. https://www.intelligencesquared.com/newsletter-signup/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

27 Nov 202431min

Ayaan Hirsi Ali On Her Fight to Save the West

Ayaan Hirsi Ali On Her Fight to Save the West

Decades ago, I escaped the Islamic world and came to the West. Many don’t know how good the West is, or how fragile. I fight for the restoration of what made the West great.’ – Ayaan Hirsi Ali Ever since writer and activist Ayaan Hirsi Ali publicly disavowed Islam, controversy has followed her every step. For many years the Somali-born former Muslim was a fierce critic of religion – particularly Islam – and became famous worldwide after publishing her controversial bestselling autobiography 'Infidel'. In the first decade of this century she was a pioneer of the New Atheist movement alongside the so-called ‘Four Horsemen’: Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens and Daniel Dennett. And then late last year Ali stunned many of her own supporters and allies when she wrote an article ‘Why I am now a Christian,’ in which she announced her conversion to Christianity and argued that the Christian belief system — not atheism — is the only means to preserve Western values. Many atheists felt that she had betrayed her life’s work and many Christians felt she had politicised their religion. In September 2024 Ali came to the Intelligence Squared stage where, in conversation with Editor-in-Chief of UnHerd Freddie Sayers, she discussed her complicated history — from escaping an arranged marriage in her early 20s to becoming a Dutch MP aged 33 and going into hiding when death threats were made against her for alleged apostasy. And she explained her conviction that Christian values are the best hope for preserving Western society. … Subscribe to our newsletter here to hear about our latest events, discounts and much more. https://www.intelligencesquared.com/newsletter-signup/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

25 Nov 202453min

How Crowd Psychology Made the Modern World, with Dan Hancox

How Crowd Psychology Made the Modern World, with Dan Hancox

Journalist and author Dan Hancox argues that despite what politicians, philosophers and the press have long told us, every peaceful crowd is not a violent mob in waiting. His new book. Multitudes, asks readers to rethink long-held assumptions about crowd behaviour and psychology, as well as the part crowds play in our lives. Hancox has written for the Guardian, the New Statesman, The Independent, The Wire and many more. His previous books include Inner City Pressure: The Story of Grime and The Village Against the World. Joining him to discuss Multitudes is Adam McCauley, the writer and researcher studying the social, cultural, and political impacts of emerging technologies. McCauley also writes a regular newsletter, The View From Here. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

24 Nov 202455min

Thomas Friedman on the Future of America and the World: The Post-Election Dissection, Part Two

Thomas Friedman on the Future of America and the World: The Post-Election Dissection, Part Two

This is the second instalment of our full-length in-depth discussion. With Donald Trump now declared winner of the 2024 presidential race, the United States stands on the brink of a new era. Yet, as New York Times columnist and Pulitzer Prize-winning author Thomas Friedman has warned, the implications of Trump’s ambitious agenda may be far from harmonious. Trump has vowed to end the war in Ukraine on his first day in office, impose tariffs on China, and pressure Israel to conclude the war in Gaza. But will these bold promises stabilise global tensions — or further stoke them? In November 2024, Friedman returned to the Intelligence Squared stage in London for his first appearance since the pandemic. In conversation with broadcaster Ritula Shah he explored whether Trump’s policies will serve America’s interests or undermine its alliances and role in global affairs. This is the second instalment of our full-length in-depth discussion. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to the full conversation immediately as an early access subscriber, plus our extra extended version of the conversation available to Members-only, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events ... Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series ... Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

22 Nov 202436min

Thomas Friedman on the Future of America and the World: The Post-Election Dissection, Part One

Thomas Friedman on the Future of America and the World: The Post-Election Dissection, Part One

With Donald Trump now declared winner of the 2024 presidential race, the United States stands on the brink of a new era. Yet, as New York Times columnist and Pulitzer Prize-winning author Thomas Friedman has warned, the implications of Trump’s ambitious agenda may be far from harmonious. Trump has vowed to end the war in Ukraine on his first day in office, impose tariffs on China, and pressure Israel to conclude the war in Gaza. But will these bold promises stabilise global tensions — or further stoke them? In November 2024, Friedman returned to the Intelligence Squared stage in London for his first appearance since the pandemic. In conversation with broadcaster Ritula Shah he explored whether Trump’s policies will serve America’s interests or undermine its alliances and role in global affairs. This is the first instalment of our full-length in-depth discussion. If you'd like to become a Member and get access to the full conversation immediately as an early access subscriber, plus our extra extended version of the conversation available to Members-only, just visit intelligencesquared.com/membership to find out more. For £4.99 per month you'll also receive: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared episodes, wherever you get your podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series - 15% discount on livestreams and in-person tickets for all Intelligence Squared events ... Or Subscribe on Apple for £4.99: - Full-length and ad-free Intelligence Squared podcasts - Bonus Intelligence Squared podcasts, curated feeds and members exclusive series ... Already a subscriber? Thank you for supporting our mission to foster honest debate and compelling conversations! Visit intelligencesquared.com to explore all your benefits including ad-free podcasts, exclusive bonus content and early access. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

20 Nov 202435min

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