The Human Risk Podcast5 Jan 2025

Kit Holden on Played in Germany - a footballing journey through a nation's soul

What can we learn about a country from its favourite sport? A lot. Particularly when that country has a history and culture like Germany. Which is what I'm exploring on this episode.

Even if you're not a football fan, this episode — in a year when Germany goes to the polls — will have something of interest.

Episode Summary
On this episode, I speak with Kit Holden, a British-German journalist and author whose love for German football has led him to uncover the rich tapestry of stories behind the Bundesliga.

Kit's perspective as an "insider, yet outsider" allows him to explore not just what happens on the pitch but also the cultural and societal dynamics that shape the game in Germany. From the legendary 50+1 ownership rule to the passionate fan culture that prioritizes community, we discuss what sets German football apart.

Kit shares his experiences writing two books: Scheisse, We're Going Up, chronicling Union Berlin’s extraordinary journey from underdog to Champions League contender, and Played in Germany, a deep dive into how football reflects the soul of the nation.

Our conversation delves into topics such as fan ownership, regional identities, and the challenges of maintaining tradition while engaging a global audience. Whether you're a football fanatic or a newcomer, this episode offers insights into the intersection of sport, society, and storytelling.

We also explore Kit’s craft as a journalist, how his bilingual skills and cultural curiosity enable him to connect with fans, players, and club officials, and the lessons football can teach us about resilience and identity. With stories that span the Ruhr Valley to the rise of East German clubs, this episode will leave you with a newfound appreciation for the beautiful game and its deeper meanings.

Guest Biography
Kit is a British-German journalist and author based in Berlin. He covers German football for Der Tagesspiegel and AFP, and his work has appeared in The Guardian, The Athletic, and Die Zeit.

Through his work, Kit explores how football reflects societal values, regional traditions, and the challenges of modern commercialization.

AI-Generated Timestamp Summary

(00:02) German Football Bundesliga and Fan Culture
German Bundesliga's unique fan-focused ownership structure and its connection to regional identities explored by journalist Kit Holden.

(08:03) Football Fan Stories
Union Berlin's rise to success is a testament to the dedication of its fans and the power of community in sports.

(17:09) East German Football Legacy and Identity
Leipzig's role in German football history divided past and present and challenging traditional values.

(21:55) Uncovering German Regional Identities Through Football
Storytelling in journalism captures historical narratives, regional identities, and football culture in Germany and the UK.

(29:22) German Football and National Identity
Football in Germany connects with the past, regional identities, and post-war narrative while acknowledging and remembering its connections to the Nazi era.

(32:50) Ultras in German Football
German football clubs have taken responsibility for their Nazi ties, with ultras playing a vital role in preserving fan power and resisting private equity investment.

(38:21) German Football and Fan Participation
German football clubs, ultras, and fans debate preserving traditional culture while remaining competitive in the global market.

(43:03) Resilience and Tradition in German Football
Fan culture, commercial interests, private equity, club identity, competitive vitality, local connections, football clubs, and supporters' identities.

(49:30) German Football Clubs and Identity Reimagined
Examining Schalke 04's decline and its impact on Gelsenkirchen while exploring diverse matchday experiences in Bundesliga clubs like Union Berlin and HSV.

Links
Kit's first book Scheisse! We’re Going Up! about Union Berlin's extraordinary rise: https://www.duckworthbooks.co.uk/book/played-in-germany/

His latest book Played in Germany: A Footballing Journey Through A Nation's Soul
https://linktr.ee/playedingermany and
https://www.duckworthbooks.co.uk/book/scheisse-were-going-up/

Kit's journalistic profiles
The Athletic: https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/author/kit-holden/

The Independent: https://www.independent.co.uk/author/kit-holden

Tagesspiegel (in German): https://www.tagesspiegel.de/autoren/kit-holden

A football fan's guide to German football: https://www.footballingermany.com/

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