220. Theory of Enchantment | Chloé Valdary

220. Theory of Enchantment | Chloé Valdary

As an alternative for those who would rather listen ad-free, sign up for a premium subscription to receive the following: *All JBP Podcast episodes ad-free *Monthly Ask-Me-Anything episodes (and the ability to ask questions) *Presale access to events *Premium, detailed show notes for future episodes Sign up here: https://jordanbpeterson.supercast.com This episode was recorded on September 15th, 2021. Chloé Valdary and I discuss The Theory of Enchantment, her personal brand of compassionate anti-racism. Chloé has been featured in Psychology Today and the NY Times. Her work with Theory of Enchantment attempts to bring compassion to diversity training and fight bigotry with love. We covered a range of topics surrounding her practice, structural racism in the US, the civil rights movement, the best way to criticize one another, the power of Truth, white fragility, and what one could expect from her (rather unique) diversity seminars. Find more from Chloé @cvaldary https://twitter.com/cvaldary & check out her program at https://theoryofenchantment.com -- Get started with a 10% discount at magbreakthrough.com/jbp when using promo code "jbp10." If it's not for you, there's a one-year money-back guarantee. _______________ Timestamps _______________ [00:00] Intro [00:30] Chloé’s background [01:52] Why did Chloé want to talk? [02:53] Reading Dr. Peterson’s Maps of Meaning in a lockdown [03:38] What is the goal or focus behind Valdary's work? [04:05] “Supremacist thinking occurs when a human being experiences... some type of deep insecurity within themselves" - Chloé Valdary [05:08] Jordan’s list of questions through Chloé's looking glass [05:49] Sources of racism [12:36] “There are problems money doesn't solve. It would be lovely if [that] produced full security in every aspect, but it doesn't" - Jordan Peterson [12:57] Working with corporations on DEIS [16:55] Debating the validity of lived experience [17:11] “Are you an unquestionable authority on the nature of your lived experience? The answer is yes and no" - JP [21:23] “[Race] certainly isn’t the best way to conceptualize diversity” - JP [23:46] Examining the pathos behind two great leaders in the civil rights movement: Dr. Martin Luther King & Malcolm X [27:34] Chloé’s experience as a teacher [33:06] Learning to appreciate complexity in both the individual and the diverse [36:17] “Raising everyone’s material standards… is ultimately insufficient" - JP [36:34] Seeing people as political abstractions [38:14] Alienation, diversity training, and rural America [44:28] “There are arbitrary pre-conditions to our existence that we didn't choose to deal with" - JP [48:25] How to uplift (never destructive) criticism [51:07] Variance in coping mechanisms [54:44] Everyone is starving for (words of) encouragement [57:07] Rooting everything in love and compassion. Where do those guidelines come from? [01:03:45] Wonder Woman, Power, & Truth [01:04:52] The human capacity to destroy the planet [01:09:29] I'm convinced that there is nothing more powerful than truth in the word." - JP [01:17:31] “Part of the problem in the West is this false understanding of meaning as derived from propositions when it is, in fact, participatory ways of knowing that give rise to propositions in the first place" - Chloé Valdary [01:18:48] The meaning of the word ‘enchantment’ [01:26:23] “The objective of ToE is to bring people back to this relational way of being and to be in balance with their own complexity" - Chloé Valdary [01:26:59] What Chloé does at a ToE seminar [01:32:16] “People have access to the truth… [regardless of] socioeconomic standing" - JP Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Episoder(581)

564. The Meaning Of: Hansel & Gretel

564. The Meaning Of: Hansel & Gretel

In this narrative analysis, Dr. Jordan B. Peterson breaks down the Grimm Brothers’ “Hansel and Gretel,” revealing the psychological and symbolic dimensions hidden within the classic tale. From the selfishness of weak fathers and malevolent stepmothers to the false promises of hyper-solicitous care, Peterson explores how the abandonment of children into the unknown mirrors moral failure at home—and how faith, courage, and sibling love can redeem it. With echoes of biblical stories and and all too modern warning about overprotective parenting, this fairy tale becomes a rich allegory for navigating betrayal, scarcity, and emerging maturity.   This episode was filmed on July 5th, 2025. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

21 Jul 202557min

563. “Something Non-Human Has Been Here A Long Time” | Dr. Garry Nolan

563. “Something Non-Human Has Been Here A Long Time” | Dr. Garry Nolan

Dr. Jordan B. Peterson interviews Stanford professor and prolific biotech entrepreneur Dr. Garry Nolan, covering the cutting-edge of cancer research and atomic-level imaging as well as his work with the U.S. government on anomalous health effects linked to unidentified aerial phenomena (UAPs). Nolan explains how his scientific curiosity—and integrity—led him from debunking the infamous Atacama “alien” mummy to analyzing bizarre materials and biological effects tied to UAP encounters. Artificial intelligence, intuition, consciousness, and the blurry line between science fiction and scientific frontier, culminate in Nolan’s provisional belief: “something non-human has been here a long time.”   This episode was filmed on July 7th, 2025     | Links |   For Dr. Garry Nolan:   On X https://x.com/garrypnolan?lang=en  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

17 Jul 20251h 35min

562. What Do We Actually Know About Autism? | Sir Simon Baron-Cohen

562. What Do We Actually Know About Autism? | Sir Simon Baron-Cohen

Dr. Jordan B. Peterson speaks with psychologist and autism researcher Dr. Simon Baron-Cohen about the nature of empathy, systemizing, and the neurological basis of autism. This needed conversation explores how humans develop theory of mind, the differences between cognitive and affective empathy, and why some individuals gravitate toward systems over social interaction. They discuss the evolutionary roots of invention, gender differences in cognition, and how autistic traits relate to creativity and pattern recognition. Unflinchingly, they also discuss the darker side of empathy deficits—including psychopathy and cruelty—raising urgent questions about compassion, human development, and our capacity for evil.   Professor of Psychology and Psychiatry at the University of Cambridge, Simon Baron-Cohen is Director of the Autism Research Centre and a global leader in autism research. He pioneered the 'mindblindness' and 'empathizing-systemizing' theories, has authored over 770 scientific papers, and was knighted in 2021 for his contributions to autism understanding. His work spans clinical practice, public education, and cutting-edge research on cognitive sex differences, empathy, and neurodiversity.   This episode was filmed on July 5th, 2025     | Links |   For Simon Baron-Cohen:   On X https://x.com/sbaroncohen?lang=en Read Dr. Baron-Cohen’s most recent book, as discussed in the show, “The Pattern Seekers: How Autism Drives Human Invention” https://a.co/d/9hsG5MR  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

14 Jul 20251h 43min

561. Scott Adams and Jordan Peterson

561. Scott Adams and Jordan Peterson

In this deeply personal interview, Dr. Jordan B. Peterson sits down with Scott Adams, cartoonist and creator of Dilbert, to explore the unlikely paths that shape a life—from illustrating a nationally syndicated hit comic to fatal illness and facing the metaphysical. Adams shares stories of coincidence and perseverance, including how affirmations, setbacks, and sheer optimism propelled him from obscurity to national fame. The conversation dives into themes of malicious envy, systems versus goals, American culture, simulation theory, and the power of narrative perception. Both reflect on trauma, purpose, and survival—making this episode a profound meditation on how we author meaning in a truly absurd world.   This episode was filmed on July 7th, 2025     | Links |   For Scott Adams:   On X https://x.com/scottadamssays?lang=en   On Youtube, watch or listen to the “Real Coffee With Scott Adams” podcast https://www.youtube.com/@RealCoffeewithScottAdams/videos   Website https://dilbert.com/  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

10 Jul 20251h 24min

560. When Does Masculinity Become Toxic? | David French

560. When Does Masculinity Become Toxic? | David French

Sparked by French’s recent New York Times article, “The Democrats’ $20 Million Man Problem,” he and Jordan Peterson discuss the societal failures contributing to male alienation—fatherlessness, loss of purpose, overmedication, and a culture that increasingly pathologizes masculinity. French shares personal insights as a father, veteran, and conservative commentator (Who is regularly published in Liberal outlets), and the two expand on themes of demoralization, the need for intentional rites of passage, and the psychological appeal of figures like Andrew Tate. The conversation closes with a stark agreement—we urgently need to reach young men with empathy, structure, and a meaningful vision for life.   This episode was filmed on July 2nd, 2025     | Links |   For David French:   On X https://x.com/davidafrench?lang=en   Read David’s work on the New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/by/david-french#latest   Read David’s most recent book, “Divided We Fall: America's Secession Threat and How to Restore Our Nation” https://a.co/d/1Ne3VBS  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

7 Jul 20251h 12min

559. How to Stop Europe’s Collapse: What We Can Learn from Germany's Mistakes | Christine Anderson

559. How to Stop Europe’s Collapse: What We Can Learn from Germany's Mistakes | Christine Anderson

Member of European Parliament Christine Anderson joins Jordan Peterson to explain the cultural, political, and economic unraveling of Germany and the EU. Mass immigration, rising crime, deindustrialization and elite-driven climate policies—Anderson argues that Europe is collapsing under the weight of its own ideological delusions. She shares her personal experience growing up near East Germany, her awakening during the 2008 financial crisis, and why the "far-right" label no longer works. If you want to understand what's really happening behind Europe's polite facade—watch or listen.   This episode was filmed on June 25th, 2025     | Links |   For Christine Anderson:   On X https://x.com/AndersonAfDMdEP   On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/christine._anderson/?hl=en  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

3 Jul 20251h 40min

558. The Meaning Of: Snow White

558. The Meaning Of: Snow White

Dr. Jordan Peterson offers a psychological and cultural analysis of the Grimm Brothers' Snow White, using it as a lens to explore evolutionary biology, female status hierarchies, fertility suppression, and the pathology of the “evil queen” archetype. Drawing on research in primatology and cultural commentary, Peterson connects ancient folklore to modern dynamics—critiquing contemporary feminist ideologies, careerism, and generational envy, while upholding the redemptive power of masculine responsibility in narrative tradition (and real life). Part myth, part science, part cultural autopsy—this is the synthesis of one of Peterson’s most impactful tenants: stories matter, and fundamental stories reiterate across time. This episode was filmed on June 24th, 2025. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

30 Jun 20251h 26min

557. Balancing Pregnancy, Motherhood and Work | Riley Gaines

557. Balancing Pregnancy, Motherhood and Work | Riley Gaines

Riley Gaines returns to speak with Dr. Jordan Peterson about marriage, pregnancy, and what it means to pursue both motherhood and mission in a culture that tells women they must choose. Riley shares how her decision to keep fighting for women’s sports and biological reality has only deepened since becoming pregnant with a daughter—and why she refuses to slow down. The fight was already personal. Now—it’s as deep as lineage.   This episode was filmed on June 23rd, 2025     | Links |   For Riley Gaines:   On X https://x.com/riley_gaines_?lang=en   Watch or listen to “Gaines For Girls” on Outkick https://www.outkick.com/shows/gaines-for-girls?_gl=1*2dhubm*_ga*NDY5NDY0Nzc2LjE3NTAxODQ0NjM.*_ga_4PQFY920BX*czE3NTA5NTg0NzMkbzIkZzEkdDE3NTA5NTg0NzQkajU5JGwwJGgw   Read “Swimming Against the Current: Fighting for Common Sense in a World That’s Lost its Mind” https://a.co/d/hQOceSV   Website https://www.rileygaines.com/  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

26 Jun 20251h 33min

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