Obsession, Secrets, and Sleight of Hand: Inside the Hidden World of Modern Magicians with Ian Frisch

Obsession, Secrets, and Sleight of Hand: Inside the Hidden World of Modern Magicians with Ian Frisch

A Note from James

I’ve always loved books where a journalist gets so deep into a subculture that they become part of it. Magic Is Dead by Ian Frisch is one of those. He starts out covering a secret society of magicians—“The 52,” named for the cards in a deck—and ends up becoming one of them.

It reminded me of other favorites like Word Freak (Scrabble), The Game (pickup artists), and Moonwalking with Einstein (memory champions). I love that genre of participation—when curiosity turns into obsession and then into mastery.

Ian’s journey pulled me right in. He didn’t just report on the world of magicians; he lived in it, practiced card tricks until his hands hurt, and learned how obsession, storytelling, and performance shape every great craft. Talking to him made me think about how every one of us could benefit from being part of more than one “world”—to have different lives, different subcultures where we’re known and respected for something unique. That’s real diversification. Not just financial, but personal.


Episode Description

In this episode, James talks with journalist and author Ian Frisch about his book Magic Is Dead: My Journey into the World’s Most Secretive Society of Magicians and what it means to go all-in on obsession.

They explore the underground network of modern magicians reinventing the art for the social-media age—tattoos, streetwear, viral videos, and all—and what these creative subcultures can teach the rest of us about mastery, storytelling, and risk.

It’s a conversation about transformation: how curiosity becomes discipline, and how the principles behind sleight of hand apply to persuasion, business, and everyday life.


What You’ll Learn

  • Why obsession—not balance—is often the key to getting great at something
  • How social media reshaped the art and culture of modern magic
  • The real psychology behind deception, storytelling, and human connection
  • How magicians build trust with skeptical audiences (and what leaders can learn from it)
  • Why belonging to multiple “worlds” or subcultures creates resilience and happiness


Timestamped Chapters

  • [00:00] Introduction — Obsession as a superpower
  • [03:00] A Note from James — The journalist who became a magician
  • [06:00] Participatory journalism and the power of total immersion
  • [10:00] What makes this genre work: transformation and obsession
  • [11:30] Discovering the new generation of social-media magicians
  • [14:00] From top hats to tattoos: how magic reinvented itself online
  • [18:30] The challenge of trust when magic meets video editing
  • [20:30] The return of live magic and the human reaction
  • [23:30] Subcultures, hierarchies, and belonging
  • [26:00] Magic as a social tool for outsiders
  • [29:00] How magicians train for a decade to master their craft
  • [37:00] Ian’s own training: learning sleight of hand as an adult
  • [40:00] The poker connection and card control secrets
  • [44:00] Why mystery matters more than the trick itself
  • [47:00] Storytelling, psychology, and reading people
  • [52:00] Applying magician skills to real-world persuasion
  • [54:00] Comedy, showmanship, and performance overlap
  • [55:30] The secret societies of magic and “The 52”
  • [58:30] Competition, creativity, and the economics of exclusivity
  • [01:00:40] How Ian earned his place as the “Two of Clubs”
  • [01:03:00] Inventing a new trick and becoming part of the story


Additional Resources


Related titles discussed:


Mentioned magicians:


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Episoder(1374)

Ep. 89 - Maria Popova: A Museum of the World

Ep. 89 - Maria Popova: A Museum of the World

Maria Popova, avid reader, writer hunter-gatherer, and curious mind-at-large joins James today on The James Altucher Show. James tells her he reads only one blog religiously and it's Maria's blog Brain Pickings.org. It started as an e-mail to a few friends with a couple of links to things that interested her. They forwarded those on to friends and before she knew it, she was writing a blog. It's a fantastic conversation, and I know once you hear it, you'll be forwarding it on to your best friends.   If you've never read Maria's blog, you must. You'll be amazed by her journey. ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

5 Feb 20151h 12min

Ep. 88 - Lewis Howes: Lewis' School of Greatness

Ep. 88 - Lewis Howes: Lewis' School of Greatness

James was recently in New York and caught up with his good friend and fellow podcaster Lewis Howes They decided to drop into the studio and record a podcast for The James Altucher Show and another for Lewis's podcast, The School of Greatness, one of James' favorite shows. Lewis' bio is simply amazing and way too long to rewrite here, but if you want to grow your business, improve your personal life, and live the live you've always dreamt of, then click here to learn how.  They jump right in and catch up since Lewis was last on The James Altucher Show (Episode 5). Lewis plays handball for the U.S. National Team Handball. You'll hear James laugh as Lewis explains this style of handball. It's like the combination of every other sport. They begin the podcast there. Lewis decided he wanted to make the U.S. National Team and, as you'll hear, he did whatever it took to get selected. James tells Lewis he's going to steal everything from all his best podcasts. They start with Lewis podcast with Yuri Elkaim and the benefits and hacks to a great night's sleep. Here's a hint... Buy a snake plant.  Next up was Lewis' amazing interview with Jim Kwik on how to master your memory.  Lewis then offers up his "common lessons of greatness"...  1.    A clear vision.  2.    Learning how to master and overcome adversity and turning adversity into an advantage.  3.    Surround yourself with really positive people. 4.    Giving yourself time to be in your messy place and being OK with it.  5.    Getting clear on what you want next and having a support team and a coach to help you get there.  6.    "Feeling the need to be heard when things are not going your way can go a long way."  They transition into the business of podcasting. Lewis just celebrated two years and he and James talk about why you just have to be there right now. If you're not already there or you're not a big name, then you may be too late to the game.  And Lewis lets us all in on a project he's getting ready to launch.  It's a pleasure to listen to two very successful, good friends share so many secrets.   ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

3 Feb 201548min

AA Ep. 202 - Casey Neistat: How to Get to 13 Million YouTube Views

AA Ep. 202 - Casey Neistat: How to Get to 13 Million YouTube Views

Casey Neistat is an American film director, producer, and creator of popular YouTube videos. While he has worked in almost every aspect of video making, he tells James that YouTube is his absolute passion. He chose to leave mainstream media for YouTube, which is the opposite of most YouTubers' aspirations. They talk about creative "ideas." Casey tells James that ideas matter very little - it's execution that matters. They talk about risk, too, and Casey has a great take on it. He tells James, "The most dangerous lifestyle anyone can live is the lifestyle where you play it safe." Casey probably disagrees with James more than anyone else James has ever interviewed.     ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

31 Jan 201539min

Ep. 87 - Tim Larkin: Necessary Violence

Ep. 87 - Tim Larkin: Necessary Violence

Tim Larkin talks with James today about pro-victim rights and personal safety. As a former military intelligence instructor who helped America's elite Navy Seals develop their hand-to-hand combat techniques, Tim has spent two decades learning about violence. He tells James the story of how he got accepted to the Navy Seals program. He exposed their problem and offered them a solution... This is an episode like no other we've brought you.   Listen today. You'll be amazed by Tim's stories. I was. ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

29 Jan 20151h 30min

Ep. 86 - Seth Godin: It's Your Turn, Now What?

Ep. 86 - Seth Godin: It's Your Turn, Now What?

Seth tells James that he had to write his new book What To Do When It's Your Turn because he had no choice. It's about what's holding you back, that voice in your head that pushes you to be mediocre or pushes you to hide. "It pushes us to dig deep inside so we can do better work and impact the things we care about." They talk about the industrial age and how it changed everything. "We invented public school to train children to sit still long enough to work in a factory." But now that we're in the postindustrial age, it's all leftover and everything has changed. They talk about why it's so important get out of your comfort zone. Seth tells James about when he realized that he was hiding from the big projects. How he was just playing it safe. Through a fortunate meeting, he realized that by speaking his truth, standing for something instead of just trying to fit in, is what gets you noticed. They transition into a great discussion about writing every day. Constantly putting yourself out there is critically important. Dance with your fear.   And read more books. ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

27 Jan 201550min

AA Ep. 195 - Jayson Gaignard: Uncommon Commonalities

AA Ep. 195 - Jayson Gaignard: Uncommon Commonalities

Building connections and building relationships are how you bring real value to the world around you. Jayson Gaignard is a super-connector. He's two degrees of separation from anyone you want to meet. Broke and $250,000 in debt, Jayson thought about an idea that nobody else was doing after getting a free ticket to hear Seth Godin speak, connecting entrepreneurs over an intimate dinner. He paid for this himself by going even further into debt with no expectations of ever making money on these. Mastermind Dinners launched and Jayson's new venture was off and running. Entrepreneurship often takes an unyielding belief in yourself, and Jayson definitely believes. Listen today to hear the story of someone who bet everything he had on an idea. His new book, Mastermind Dinners Build Lifelong Relationships by Connecting Experts, Influencers and Linchpins is a fantastic read and he hosts a podcast, Mastermind Talks you really need to subscribe to. Ask a question at Askaltucher.com. ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

25 Jan 201528min

Ep. 85 - David Levien: I Just Have To

Ep. 85 - David Levien: I Just Have To

James and David Levien talk about the art and the science of writing books and screenplays, producing and directing movies, plus making this your full-time career. Eventually he teamed up with his longtime best friend Brian Koppelman (Episode 59) but the road to success was tough. Like most screenwriters, he moved to Hollywood to launch his career. He started as an assistant to a talent agent hoping to get the contacts in place when he had his script ready. But over the couple of years he was there, he read thousands of scripts which left him very little time to work on his own. He made contacts but they didn't see him as a screenwriter. His dream just wasn't happening... He was stuck, so he just quit and for the next six years he was just another obscure writer living in N.Y. He and Brian finally reunited and decided they'd join forces to try writing a screenplay together. They had no idea what they were going to write about but they just kept at it. As luck would have it, Brian was invited to The Mayfair Club for a game of poker. He immediately called David and said, "This place was amazing. We can make the movie about this." And they did... Rounders was picked up, made into the movie, and David's career took off. But success never slowed him down. He knew he had more to give. Listen here as he talks about how he wrote City of The Sunwhile he commuted every day on the train. Plus, he tells James about his new book Signature Kill.   Listen today... It's a great conversation ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

22 Jan 20151h 6min

Ep. 84 - Ben Mezrich: The Art and Science of Being a Successful Author

Ep. 84 - Ben Mezrich: The Art and Science of Being a Successful Author

James and Ben Mezrich dig deep into the art and science of writing books as a full-time career. His parents gave him two years to make a go at it, but secretly he gave himself five. As Ben tells James, he never wanted to do anything else. After college, he locked himself in his apartment and wrote nine novels. He got rejection letter after rejection letter, about 190 in all. Eventually he found an agent and finally sold his first book, then his second and his third. But as he says... Nobody was reading them, until he finally got his break. Ben has now authored fifteen best-selling books. His book, The Accidental Billionaires: The Founding of Facebook, a Tale of Sex, Money, Genius and Betrayal - debuted at #4 on the New York Times list. The book was adapted into the movie The Social Network - written by Aaron Sorkin and directed by David Fincher - and was #1 at the box office for two weeks, won Golden Globes for best picture, best director, best adapted screenplay, best score, and was nominated for eight Oscars, winning three. They also talk about his new book, Q. "The real information superhighway isn't in your computer it's in the sewer system." Q is the story of a regular cop, Benjamin Grady, who suddenly finds himself on the front line of an unyielding, terrifying epidemic. His job is simple- to quarantine the Probables- those most likely to be carrying a deadly disease. But Grady quickly learns that no amount of training, no amount of lectures from the experts at the CDC or the military infectious disease specialists can prepared him for a society on the verge of losing the war to a microscopic, unrelenting scourge.   Plus, He breaks a secret on the show today and tells James about his next book. ------------What do YOU think of the show? Head to JamesAltucherShow.com/listeners and fill out a short survey that will help us better tailor the podcast to our audience!Are you interested in getting direct answers from James about your question on a podcast? Go to JamesAltucherShow.com/AskAltucher and send in your questions to be answered on the air!------------Visit Notepd.com to read our idea lists & sign up to create your own!My new book, Skip the Line, is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever books are sold!Join the You Should Run for President 2.0 Facebook Group, where we discuss why you should run for President.I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltuchershow.com------------Thank you so much for listening! If you like this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe to "The James Altucher Show" wherever you get your podcasts: Apple PodcastsiHeart RadioSpotifyFollow me on social media:YouTubeTwitterFacebookLinkedIn See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

20 Jan 201550min

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