The Great Simplification with Nate Hagens5 Feb 2025

Always Adding More: The Unpopular Reality about Energy Transitions with Jean-Baptiste Fressoz

(Conversation recorded on November 6th, 2024)

The vision of a carbon-free, net-zero society is often framed around the promise of transitioning away from fossil fuels. But what can we learn from past "energy transitions" that might inform how feasible – or unrealistic – this vision actually is?

Today, Nate is joined by energy and technology historian Jean-Baptiste Fressoz for a lesson on the importance of understanding the historical trajectory of energy use for realistically navigating the unprecedented challenges humanity faces today – including the dominant narrative of a modern-day "energy transition." Jean-Baptiste explores the interdependent relationship between different energy sources—from wood to coal to oil—and reveals how this history shapes our hopes for renewables and nuclear energy moving forward.

How can examining the history of energy and material use help us fully grasp the scale at which human societies actually consume them? What role do our current economic systems play in driving an ever-growing demand for new energy sources? In the history of our species, have we ever fully transitioned off of one energy source and replaced it with another – and what does this imply for the hope of a fossil-free future?

About Jean Baptiste Fressoz:

Jean-Baptiste Fressoz is a historian and researcher at the Alexandre Koyré Center of the School for Advanced Studies in the Social Sciences in Paris, France. His work focuses on environmental history, technology and energy, and the Anthropocene. He is the author of Happy Apocalypse: A History of Technological Risk, as well as the co-author of the book Chaos in the Heavens: The Forgotten History of Climate Change. Most recently, he wrote More and More and More: An All Consuming History of Energy.

Show Notes and More

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