Cleaning Up: Leadership in an Age of Climate Change14 Touko 2025

Can You Run a Grid Entirely On Renewables? Ep208: Anders Lindberg

Can You Run A Grid Without Fossil Fuels?

"Yes," says Anders Lindberg, President of Energy and Executive VP at Wärtsilä, on this week's episode of Cleaning Up. It'll just cost €65 trillion extra by 2050.

Anders' team at Wärtsilä has recently published its Crossroads to Net Zero report, which argues that keeping a little bit of flexible generation on the grid will save huge amounts of money as the globe strives for net zero, while also speeding up the transition to renewables. The argument centres on what to do with the last few percent of power supply, and what forms of generation need to be built to ensure consistent electricity supply and prevent black or brown outs.

Perhaps unsurprisingly for a gas engine manufacturer, Wärtsilä's report makes the case that gas should provide the last few percentage points of electricity generation. Michael Liebreich puts that claim to the test.

Discover more:

Wärtsilä's Crossroads to Net Zero report: https://www.wartsila.com/energy/towards-100-renewable-energy/choosing-the-optimal-pathway-for-energy-transition
Can Germany’s Gas Giant Go Green? Ep206: Michael Lewis - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOD-f6uSPgc
Q&A: What we do – and do not – know about the blackout in Spain and Portugal — https://www.carbonbrief.org/qa-what-we-do-and-do-not-know-about-the-blackout-in-spain-and-portugal/
ENTSO-E expert panel initiates the investigation into the causes of Iberian blackout: https://www.entsoe.eu/news/2025/05/09/entso-e-expert-panel-initiates-the-investigation-into-the-causes-of-iberian-blackout

Leadership Circle:

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live.

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Are Fossil Fuel Cars About to Have Their Kodak Moment? Ep248: Fiona Howarth

What happens when millions of electric cars become part of the energy grid? And could the key to cheaper, cleaner power already be sitting in your driveway? And why are so many automakers pushing back...

11 Maalis 1h 9min

Iran Will Reshape Oil, Gas & Clean Energy For Years To Come | Bryony Worthington & Michael Liebreich

Bryony Worthington and Michael Liebreich give their analysis of the impact of the conflict in Iran on global energy markets. How will it impact the Middle East, Europe, Asia, the US, and will it force...

6 Maalis 52min

⁠⁠How To Build Quickly In An Era of Fossil Fuel Shocks | Ep247: Hilde Tonne

How can we build out clean energy and infrastructure faster? Is Europe engineering its way to resilience, or pricing itself out of competitiveness? And can we redesign the entire system fast enough to...

4 Maalis 53min

The Audacious Plan To Build a Transatlantic Electricity Cable | Ep246: Laurent Segalen

This week on Cleaning Up, host Bryony Worthington sits down with investor and energy strategist Laurent Segalen, co-host of the Redefining Energy podcast, for a sweeping conversation that spans carbon...

25 Helmi 51min

Why Renewables Are Booming Despite the Politics | Ep245: Miguel Stilwell d'Andrade

This week on Cleaning Up, Michael Liebreich sits down with Miguel Stilwell d’Andrade, CEO of EDP, one of the world’s leading clean energy companies.From the front lines of the energy transition, Migue...

18 Helmi 1h 3min

The Billion-Tonne Promise of Carbon Dioxide Removal Isn't Working Out | Ep244: Robert Höglund

This week on Cleaning Up, Michael Liebreich sits down with carbon removal insider Robert Höglund, CEO of Marginal Carbon, co-founder of CDR.fyi and architect of MilkyWire’s Climate Transformation Fund...

11 Helmi 1h 9min

The World Decides: Clean Energy or Oil & Gas? | Ep243: Damilola Ogunbiyi

What if the future of clean energy isn’t decided in Washington, Brussels, or Beijing, but in Lagos, Nairobi, and Addis Ababa? Are we underestimating how fast the Global South is leapfrogging fossil fu...

4 Helmi 56min

The State of the Climate 2026 | Ep242: Zeke Hausfather

How do we model the climate system? How warm will 2026 be? And can geoengineering be anything more than a bandaid? This week on Cleaning Up, Bryony Worthington sits down with leading climate scientis...

28 Tammi 1h 11min