#115 Anthropic at $170B: Should Unicorns Be Forced to IPO?
More or Less5 Sep 2025

#115 Anthropic at $170B: Should Unicorns Be Forced to IPO?

Another busy week in tech and your favorite quad are back! We go over: Google’s antitrust “win,” AI M&A mania, Anthropic’s stay-private debate, why lawyers out-earn bankers now, and the barbell reality of internet businesses. We also unpack creator vs algorithm dynamics, the rise of Ozempic, and Sam’s wild “AI petty-lawsuit bot” idea.


Chapters:02:07 – OpenAI’s $300k copywriting hire → AI not there yet

09:03 – AI M&A deals are small relative to hype

10:55 – Lawyers now out-earning bankers

12:40 – Google’s antitrust “loss” turned into a win

17:31 – Government says “AI will handle capitalism”

22:02 – Debate: force unicorns public at $100B+

40:15 – Creators must transcend algorithms, not rely on feeds

45:07 – Only ~20M Americans really buy things — own that niche

56:07 – AI petty-lawsuit bots as the next “big market”

57:22 – AI is just compute wars, zero net value


We’re also on ↓

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Instagram: https://instagram.com/moreorless

YouTube: https://youtu.be/W1HVKJZg7qo


Connect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

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Episoder(172)

Agentic Commerce Hits a Wall: Hilton, Amazon and the Bot Blocking Fight

Agentic Commerce Hits a Wall: Hilton, Amazon and the Bot Blocking Fight

Meta and Microsoft, two of Anthropic's biggest enterprise customers, have roughly halved their Claude usage, and both are running their own models instead. Dave's diagnosis is the one nobody else is m...

9 Okt 53min

Meta Muse vs Instinct vs OpenAI Dots: Do AI Agents Have Any Moat?

Meta Muse vs Instinct vs OpenAI Dots: Do AI Agents Have Any Moat?

Anthropic's S-1 leaked and the numbers are not what the narrative promised: revenue flatlining as token prices drop, and SaaS investors posting memes welcoming Anthropic to the no-growth table. Jess s...

2 Okt 57min

Claude Is Doing Science, a16z Is Starting a University & the AI Bubble Keeps Growing and Still Be a Terrible Business; We'd Rather Send Our Kids to the Military Than to a16z's School

Claude Is Doing Science, a16z Is Starting a University & the AI Bubble Keeps Growing and Still Be a Terrible Business; We'd Rather Send Our Kids to the Military Than to a16z's School

Andreessen Horowitz puts $35 million into a new school and the pod nearly falls apart over it. Sam says he'd rather send his kids to the military, Jess is all for fixing higher ed but not with two ven...

25 Sep 58min

Anthropic Wants to Slow AI Down & Instinct Wants a $10B Valuation. Is It Because They're Losing? Is Dario Amodei Actually Right?

Anthropic Wants to Slow AI Down & Instinct Wants a $10B Valuation. Is It Because They're Losing? Is Dario Amodei Actually Right?

Finally, a full house week where Sam is back from New York and the squad is back for a full dive into this week’s AI drama. Anthropic's Dario wrote a long essay calling for the AI race to slow down, w...

18 Sep 56min

iPhone Duo, Meta Muse & Why AI Finally Scared Dave Morin

iPhone Duo, Meta Muse & Why AI Finally Scared Dave Morin

Dave Morin goes hands-on with Apple's iPhone Duo, the crew tests Meta's new Muse agent and asks whether it can hold up once Google ships its own, and Dave explains why OpenAI's Astra is the first AI m...

11 Sep 51min

AI Agents Are Going Rogue. Should We Be Worried?

AI Agents Are Going Rogue. Should We Be Worried?

Sam has entered what Jessica calls the “recursive Sam loop,” producing children’s media in his own voice, letting agents deploy their own apps, and having bots track his health. But things take a turn...

4 Sep 55min

Meta’s $17B Reckoning & Why Parents Can’t Compete With Big Tech's Algorithm

Meta’s $17B Reckoning & Why Parents Can’t Compete With Big Tech's Algorithm

Sam is recording poolside, Jess is embracing her agentic era, and somehow that’s the least chaotic part of this week’s episode. The squad digs into Meta’s $17 billion settlement over child safety and ...

28 Aug 54min

Stripe Buys OpenRouter, OpenAI vs. Anthropic & the AI Backlash

Stripe Buys OpenRouter, OpenAI vs. Anthropic & the AI Backlash

Stripe buys OpenRouter for billions, which naturally raises the question: did Stripe just buy critical AI infrastructure, or a very expensive router with great distribution? The original squad is back...

21 Aug 56min

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