Making Sense with Sam Harris25 Mar 2025

#404 — What If Consciousness Is Fundamental?

Sam Harris speaks with his wife, Annaka Harris, about LIGHTS ON, her ten-part audio documentary exploring the perplexities of consciousness and the cosmos. They discuss the hard problem of consciousness, whether consciousness is fundamental, what split-brain patients can teach us about consciousness, what consciousness being fundamental could mean for the world of physics, and other topics.

After Annaka's conversation with Sam, we present an excerpt from LIGHTS ON.

Chapter 8: Space and Time features author and science writer George Musser, as well as physicists Lee Smolin and Carlo Rovelli. Annaka draws on their noted expertise to explore some of the most mystifying conclusions in quantum theory, how they may validate certain meditative insights, and the ways in which they challenge our basic understanding of reality.

Everyday experience tells us that space fills the universe; that causes have effects across time; that the future exists only as potential; that consciousness is confined to intelligent creatures, rather than fundamental to the very structure of being. These bedrock assumptions, when examined through both modern physics and contemplative practices, prove surprisingly fragile—and the fabric of existence profoundly counterintuitive.

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Learning how to train your mind is the single greatest investment you can make in life. That's why Sam Harris created the Waking Up app. From rational mindfulness practice to lessons on some of life's most important topics, join Sam as he demystifies the practice of meditation and explores the theory behind it.

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