#169 – Paul Niehaus on whether cash transfers cause economic growth, and keeping theft to acceptable levels

#169 – Paul Niehaus on whether cash transfers cause economic growth, and keeping theft to acceptable levels

"One of our earliest supporters and a dear friend of mine, Mark Lampert, once said to me, “The way I think about it is, imagine that this money were already in the hands of people living in poverty. If I could, would I want to tax it and then use it to finance other projects that I think would benefit them?”

I think that's an interesting thought experiment -- and a good one -- to say, “Are there cases in which I think that's justifiable?” — Paul Niehaus

In today’s episode, host Luisa Rodriguez interviews Paul Niehaus — co-founder of GiveDirectly — on the case for giving unconditional cash to the world's poorest households.

Links to learn more, summary and full transcript.

They cover:

  • The empirical evidence on whether giving cash directly can drive meaningful economic growth
  • How the impacts of GiveDirectly compare to USAID employment programmes
  • GiveDirectly vs GiveWell’s top-recommended charities
  • How long-term guaranteed income affects people's risk-taking and investments
  • Whether recipients prefer getting lump sums or monthly instalments
  • How GiveDirectly tackles cases of fraud and theft
  • The case for universal basic income, and GiveDirectly’s UBI studies in Kenya, Malawi, and Liberia
  • The political viability of UBI
  • Plenty more

Chapters:

  • Cold open (00:00:00)
  • Luisa’s intro (00:00:58)
  • The basic case for giving cash directly to the poor (00:03:28)
  • Comparing GiveDirectly to USAID programmes (00:15:42)
  • GiveDirectly vs GiveWell’s top-recommended charities (00:35:16)
  • Cash might be able to drive economic growth (00:41:59)
  • Fraud and theft of GiveDirectly funds (01:09:48)
  • Universal basic income studies (01:22:33)
  • Skyjo (01:44:43)


Producer and editor: Keiran Harris
Audio Engineering Lead: Ben Cordell
Technical editing: Dominic Armstrong and Milo McGuire
Additional content editing: Luisa Rodriguez and Katy Moore
Transcriptions: Katy Moore

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